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Topic: Keith says he "wrote all over ABB", from Conneticut to France and back to England....from Return to archive Page: 1 2
November 11th, 2005 08:57 PM
Neocon It seems to me that Mick and Keith made a deal about which songs would be talked about.

If Keith or Mick have an initial idea and they both work on it, what investment do they have in working on each other's songs?

It seems like they had deal. For example, Keith comes up with the riff and and barnyard lyrics for Rough Justice, so it is regarded as Keith's song. Knowing this will be the case no matter how much craft work he adds, why should he be invested? It leads to bad blood.

It seems they knew they would be asked these types of questions and agreed that they would really only talk about a few songs. Back of My Hand, Let Me Down Slow, and Rough Justice are prime examples. Songs Keith sings vocals on are dead give aways.

Songs like Dangerous Beauty, She Saw Me Coming, It Won't Take Long seem like they could have Keith roots.
November 11th, 2005 09:02 PM
Neocon I meant what investment would Mick have in working on Rough Justice if all that he's going to hear is it's Keith's? It leads to resentment and non team type thinking.
November 11th, 2005 09:06 PM
Gazza
quote:
Bloozehound wrote:



Gazza, what was the timeline of events that lead up to the albums release, for some reason I'm a bit hazy on the finer details other than this nutshell: new album/tour announcement late last year, Mick and Keith in France around this time last year working on songs, 2 weeks of booked studio time in Feb/March(?) and then the final mastering this summer

Do you find anything hasty or unusual about any of this, and didn't the studio time initially stir-up rumors that Wood and Watts were only coming in for redub work or just "phoning-in" their parts, leading many to think the songs must have already been recorded without them



[Edited by Bloozehound]



http://www.timeisonourside.com/lpBang.html

Charlie wasnt at the original sessions as he was receiving radiotherapy (the announcement that he had throat cancer was around 22/8/04, although he had been under treatment for a couple of months prior to that). The initial sessions only consisted of Mick and Keith

Charlie joined them in the session in late 2004, I think after they had spent some more time together working on new songs

I dont think Woody came on board until March (after he played his solo gig in London on 13/3/05. Darryl Jones probably was added around that time too as he was playing with Woody in London)


because of the problems surrounding Charlie, Mick and Keith simply spent more time working on demos and backing tracks themselves than they usually would. Therefore, more of the album was done that usual by the time Woody arrived. When you have 3 guys in the band who play guitar, lets face it you dont really NEED all of them in the studio together. Its not like the way you need Mick to be there and sing and Charlie to play drums - ie theyre doing something which cant really be done by the others to the same degree.
November 11th, 2005 09:19 PM
speedfreakjive IMO its all just negative hype this whole "Where's Keith on ABB" moan, Its been said before, but Stones fans should just be happy they can still play live let alone produce a fucking good album. Who cares, it beats B2B VL, and everything since Tattoo (sic)
[Edited by speedfreakjive]
November 11th, 2005 09:42 PM
JuanTCB I'd rather have Mick bring an almost complete song into the studio and have Keith tinker with it rather than some song-doctor like Diane Warren or Linda Perry!

Seriously, though - when was the last time Mick & Keith really wrote face to face, knee to knee, head to head?
November 11th, 2005 10:07 PM
IanBillen I will say this.

I think when this DVD comes out the rest of my original statement will be basically proven.

*Remember just three short weeks ago I was an ass and completely out of my mind for thinking this.

I was also totaly out of my mind when I said they would definately do stadiums this time around as usual and folks said they wouldn't sell them. I said the album was plenty finished by the time the press conference was scheduled and folks were saying it was only 10% finished and I was an ass for thinking such. Well it wasn't 100% finished and I was surprised at that. It was however "85% finished" as Micks sttated at the press conference when asked. Again I wasn't out of the ball park then and I do not think I am now.

I am not the type to say I told you so. That is immature and irritating. I have been wrong before. I don't think I will ever be let to live down the Tattoo You thing (and I still at times look through my old magazines to find the article I saw something on that in) But I will end with this. Don't discount everything I say as being complete rubbish just beacause at times a few folks say so because they feel it is their duty.

Just look at the facts with an open mind as I do.

Ok I gave my speel on how I'm not ALWAYS wrong so onward.
[Edited by IanBillen]
November 11th, 2005 10:50 PM
wgwalsh Hey folks, can't you hear the music ? The answers to the questions are therein !

Everyone has their own unique signature.

I am pushing fifty years old, and have delved into their entire catalogue complete with the boots from way back when.

After all of those years you recognize a person's style and contributions to a piece of work.

Really dig the new work, especially INFAMY.

Hang fire Ian ! There is still more juice left in the grape.
November 12th, 2005 02:45 AM
IanBillen
quote:
wgwalsh wrote:
Hey folks, can't you hear the music ? The answers to the questions are therein !

Everyone has their own unique signature.

I am pushing fifty years old, and have delved into their entire catalogue complete with the boots from way back when.

After all of those years you recognize a person's style and contributions to a piece of work.

Really dig the new work, especially INFAMY.

Hang fire Ian ! There is still more juice left in the grape.

____________________________________________________________________________


Fuck yeah there is. And "the Juice keeps cumming and I know why"!

Ian

November 12th, 2005 09:29 AM
Hannalee I have no opinion to offer on how much of the album was "Keith's", but the question and answer in the interview were about where Keith was while he was working on it - there was no discussion about how much he contributed.
November 12th, 2005 10:02 AM
IanBillen [quote]Hannalee wrote:
I have no opinion to offer on how much of the album was "Keith's", but the question and answer in the interview were about where Keith was while he was working on it - there was no discussion about how much he contributed.

___________________________________________________________________________

Well not entirely. Keith said he wrote "all over the album, really"

Also he stated he was working on the material in Conneticut, and England without Mick. The material in subject was the songs from ABB. Then he went on to describe how he writes. Without Mick? I didn't think Keith was capable any more...

Ian
[Edited by IanBillen]
November 12th, 2005 11:26 AM
oldkr ian do you reaslly think that as musicians (its their job) they write nothing until they walk arm in arm to the studio?

both mick and keith write stuff , they bring it in they trade off , new i deas get sprung and songs get written

btw there was never a golden time where they sat down with one pen a legal pad and an ashtray and wrote the entire album together

BECAUSE IM OLDKR
November 12th, 2005 12:33 PM
Neocon Yes that's right. They bring in ideas and jam them, change them and add ideas. Of course they start on their own.
November 12th, 2005 04:25 PM
prism Keith came into the sessions with lots of ideas and song titles. Mick took Keith's song titles and ideas and wrote stories to go with them. Rain Fall Down and Look What the Cat Dragged In were originally Keith's titles. It reminds me of Wild Horses. Keith wrote the original Wild Horses but Mick took hold of it and changed the lyrics so that it seemed kind of like a Mick song in the end. (That's why people wonder if it's about Anita or Marianne. It's about both.) With Bigger Bang, Keith was so happy that Mick was enthusiastic about writing closely with him that he didn't mind Mick adding his own story lines and trying to take control of the songs in general. There are Keith lyrics in most every song.
November 12th, 2005 06:27 PM
Gazza thank you my dear Prism

an interesting insight, as always
November 12th, 2005 07:41 PM
Hannalee
quote:
IanBillen wrote:
[quote]Hannalee wrote:
I have no opinion to offer on how much of the album was "Keith's", but the question and answer in the interview were about where Keith was while he was working on it - there was no discussion about how much he contributed.

___________________________________________________________________________

Well not entirely. Keith said he wrote "all over the album, really"

Also he stated he was working on the material in Conneticut, and England without Mick. The material in subject was the songs from ABB. Then he went on to describe how he writes. Without Mick? I didn't think Keith was capable any more...

Ian
[Edited by IanBillen]



Sigh.
JL: So where did you write it?
KR: You kind of write it all over the place, etc etc

This is not the same as writing all over the album....
Nor is working on material necessarily the same as writing/composing it. IMO

Mind you, the working method Keith describes would certainly explain the length of time the album took.

November 12th, 2005 08:51 PM
IanBillen [quote]Hannalee wrote:


Sigh.
JL: So where did you write it?
KR: You kind of write it all over the place, etc etc

This is not the same as writing all over the album....
Nor is working on material necessarily the same as writing/composing it. IMO

Mind you, the working method Keith describes would certainly explain the length of time the album took.

___________________________________________________________________________
I see. I'll have to listen to it again. It was pretty choppy here in the states and I did wonder why the reporter asked a question like "where did you write on it" instead of another way of putting it. I have no way of rewinding it here on my player. I can only go all the way back to like a 10 minute segment before the interview even started so I was like ahhh forget it.

Reguardless he did state how he worked the songs in Conneticut and England without Mick. Besides France.

Ian
[Edited by IanBillen]
November 12th, 2005 10:19 PM
gotdablouse
quote:
prism wrote:
Keith came into the sessions with lots of ideas and song titles. Mick took Keith's song titles and ideas and wrote stories to go with them. Rain Fall Down and Look What the Cat Dragged In were originally Keith's titles. It reminds me of Wild Horses. Keith wrote the original Wild Horses but Mick took hold of it and changed the lyrics so that it seemed kind of like a Mick song in the end. (That's why people wonder if it's about Anita or Marianne. It's about both.) With Bigger Bang, Keith was so happy that Mick was enthusiastic about writing closely with him that he didn't mind Mick adding his own story lines and trying to take control of the songs in general. There are Keith lyrics in most every song.



Very interesting post, don't thing I'd read about these titles being Keith's before, but he certainly has a "knack" for crafting catchy titles, probably more so than fully developped lyrics (as seen in his two solo albums) so that makes sense. Too bad they didn't resurrect "Randy Whore" or " Got Away with Murder" for the sessions ;-)
November 13th, 2005 01:00 AM
exile a great insight into the making of A Bigger Bang and a great Interview with Keith and Mick

Premiere Radio - Part 1
The Stones broadcast nationally to over 3 million listeners while in New York with Premiere Radio.

http://www.rollingstones.com/virtualticket/

You have to be a member however if someone can record it and upload somewhere.
November 13th, 2005 04:02 AM
IanBillen [quote]oldkr wrote:
ian do you reaslly think that as musicians (its their job) they write nothing until they walk arm in arm to the studio?

both mick and keith write stuff , they bring it in they trade off , new i deas get sprung and songs get written

btw there was never a golden time where they sat down with one pen a legal pad and an ashtray and wrote the entire album together

BECAUSE IM OLDKR

-----------------------------------------------------------------

I realize all of that. Mick said the two worked "Knee to Knee" on the album while sitting on the couch. What your saying leads to my original arguement in that Keith definately played a major role in the writing of this album is all I am saying.

You had folks here claiming that Keith wrote only two friggin songs and those were Infamy and This Place is Empty. They said Keiths writing chops were basically all dried up and they said blatently Mick for the most part single handidly wrote the entire album because of Keith's inability to write songs anymore.

I told them that is bullocks due to the fact is all I kept seeing and hearing from everyone who was around them at the time is the two were working more closely together and working as a team on ABB more than they had in 25 years. And believe me when I tell you OLDKR that 9 out of 10 people told me I was a complete ass for believing that ....that was less than a month ago.

Now people are finally starting to realize that infact their is strong evidence as we are finding out the details that Keith was vital in writing this album.

Ian
November 13th, 2005 04:25 AM
prism I think Keith wrote most of the Rough Justice lyrics because when he was in France I faxed him pictures of my new fox terrier Ruff, who chases after swans and ducks. But it could be coincidence. If it's not just coincidence, it means Rough Justice was written in early 2005, sometime after February 14th.
November 13th, 2005 06:16 AM
gotdablouse You fax pictures of your dog to Keith ?! Nice ! Tell us more about !
November 14th, 2005 08:59 PM
gotdablouse that was a promising topic any more Keith scoops ?
November 15th, 2005 04:44 AM
Gazza
quote:
IanBillen wrote:
Now people are finally starting to realize that infact their is strong evidence as we are finding out the details that Keith was vital in writing this album.

Ian



name them

1. IanBillen


anyone else?
November 15th, 2005 09:33 PM
Neocon
quote:
Gazza wrote:


name them

1. IanBillen


anyone else?



Game, set, match for Mr. Ian Billen! Keith wrote Rough Justice, one of the top 3 tracks on the album! Also, he didn't hopefully have any part in writing Streets of Love. That should really be a minus -3 for Mick. If Keith had anything to do with writing this, then -3 for Keith. Carry that torch proud Ian! Now it's time to stretch out in the afterglow!
November 16th, 2005 04:56 AM
tumbled for further information take it from the horse's mouth. Still no mention of who wrote what but describes the
collaboration process:
this http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio2/shows/long/stones.shtml

This is Janice Long BBC2 interview of Keith in Philadelphia 10/05 fast forward to minute 19.21 when it starts.

Note: This interview will disappear from the site in 2-3 days Ronnie's is already gone b4 I could transcribe it)
[Edited by tumbled]
November 16th, 2005 11:52 PM
Neocon Did Mick say anything about the writing process. All I really got from the Keith interview is the sense he was yet again drunk, repeating himself, shaking, and drooling. I did't learn much more about the writing process.

I was interested if him and Mick talked about the album being thematic, whether the title "Dangerous Beauty" actually began with Lyndi England or whatever her name was in mind, who is "Laugh I Nearly Died" directed to. Who laughing? Who'se nearly dying? An extreme metaphore? What are the alleged barebones idea Keith brought in addition to the more formed tracks RJ, TPIE and Imfamy? How barebones? Did they evolve in unexpected ways? Did they exist in the first place to have chance to evolve? How did they for on LMDS, together or seperate? She Saw Me Coming? OHNO Not You Again, It Won't Take Long? Seems there may be interesting stories, but we always have to speculate.
November 17th, 2005 12:36 AM
glencar WOW. Howe did I miss this most inane of IanBillen threads for so long. Good insights from prism & others but please, let's all learn to ignore IanBillen's crazeeeee assed rants.
November 17th, 2005 08:46 AM
Neocon Ian, good job on the keith follow through stuff. You're right about some of it and it has made others a bit defensive. Keith appreciates it and I'm sure that's really all that matters.
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