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Hong Kong Harbour Fest, November 9, 2003 by Mike Clarke
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Topic: the scoop on the so-called "new songs" Return to archive Page: 1 2
10-30-03 05:29 PM
T&A ..posted on IORR...


The so - called new songs aren't songs at all, just the band (with chuck l.) jamming the studio. At the end of jam #1 Keith remarks "extreme western grip" therefore a titlet is born. Jam #2 Mick grunts and groans "well well" No new songs! How deceiving !!!!!!.
10-30-03 05:39 PM
Fiji Joe Boycott!!!!!!

You with me SS?
10-30-03 05:41 PM
Sir Stonesalot Well, if it's posted on IORR then it must be the gospel truth!

I'll wait and see, thank you very much.
10-30-03 05:46 PM
Scot Rocks Hopefully this is untrue
10-30-03 05:49 PM
Some Guy This sux!!!
10-30-03 05:51 PM
T&A being posted on IORR doesn't make it untrue. Sounds like this guy actually listened to it. And, to tell you the truth, this sounds much more plausible than two actual new songs being "released" on a DVD...that never made a whole lot of sense to me.
10-30-03 05:57 PM
VoodooChileInWOnderl Wait this is good news, I do prefer an improvized jam by the current stones rather that new songs like the ones at 40 licks

improvized jams on studio while recording have been the beginning of the best songs in rock history
10-30-03 05:59 PM
souldoggie I'm with you T&A. Those songs being unfinished jams makes a whole lot more sense to me. Bring em on, fine by me. It cracks me up how this will be labeled as some sort of big bummer or something.

We're actually going to get 4 DVD's for $30.00 just a few weeks from the end of the tour. Does anyone realize how precious this is? I've been following this band for many, many years. This sort of release (the value, the quantity, the speed) has just never happened before.
10-30-03 06:04 PM
Sir Stonesalot >being posted on IORR doesn't make it untrue.<

It doesn't make it true either.

Besides, I'm not buying the DVD for 2 new audio tracks. I'm buying it for the live footage and the doco films.

I don't really care about the 2 new "songs".

Oh, and you haven't seen DVD Audio yet? There's a whole section of them at Best Buy.
10-30-03 06:05 PM
luxury1 and I am with you Voodoo. I love to listen to these guys jam in the studio. Back to their roots--a little raw and sloppy with a soulful bluesy groove. One can only hope.....
10-30-03 06:08 PM
Gazza >improvized jams on studio while recording have been the beginning of the best songs in rock history

yeah but the thing is,we're only GETTING the jams (if the story is true) NOT the finished "best songs in history"!!

I'm dumbfounded to think they would actually use two loose jams as a selling point on a DVD by marketing them as two "new songs". Shhhhhhurely they wouldn't mislead us....would they?

10-30-03 06:12 PM
Scot Rocks It is always good to hear new completed material, been a long time since the last album, so anything is appreciated. I was looking forward to hearing two complete new songs however I would be getting the DVD anyway for all the other great stuff thats there.


10-30-03 06:12 PM
T&A Gazza:

And, I think that's the point...the mis-advertising is what's concerning. I think it will be cool to watch the jams. But, I'm sure some folks will be disappointed due to the labeling, which is mis-leading.

This ain't DVD Audio, either - that's a whole 'nuther technology...
10-30-03 06:28 PM
Some Guy This sux!!
10-30-03 07:47 PM
Angiegirl
quote:
Gazza wrote:
Shhhhhhurely they wouldn't mislead us....would they?


Noooooooooo...of course not! They would NEVER do that to us, they are so loyal to their fans, always have been, right?

10-30-03 08:02 PM
Fiji Joe When did they state that there would be "two new songs"?

If they did, and the IORR post is true, with Mick saying that at the end...Then guess who can kiss my ass?...won't turn me off of the Stones, but it will turn me off of this DVD...Fiji don't like being lied to...Alas, I will reserve judgment until the DVD is released and reviewed by some of my RO buddies...
10-30-03 08:10 PM
Boomy Feej!! How's it goin' my K-State friend?

The following tracklisting from Best Buy doesn't specifically label them a "new songs", but it seems like it implies it. We shall judge it on November 11th at the DVD watching chat thingamajig.



Rolling Stones: Four Flicks (Four Discs) - DVD

Release Date: 11/11/2003











Aspect Ratio: 4:3 and 16:9








Studio: TGA Entertainment






















Version Details













Languages/Sound Eng/Dolby 5.1/PCM Stereo





Screen Formats FS





Additional Features Documentaries include:

"Tip of the Tongue," is a never seen before documentary chronicling the conception and preparations for the innovative 3 show/3 venue concept from the recording studio in Paris to Toronto where the band prepares for their "Licks" World Tour.

"Licks Around the World" offers fans the opportunity to travel on the road with the Rolling Stones, from the tour's beginnings in the United States, through Japan, India, Europe and the United Kingdom, with bootleg tracks "Beast of Burden," "Bitch," "You Don't Have To Mean It," and many other hidden features.

Bonus tracks include:

The Bootlegs

Paris Studio
1. Well Well
2. Extreme Western Grip

Circus Krone - June 8, 2003
1. Can't Turn You Loose

Wiltern Theatre - November 4, 2003
1. Beast of Burden
2. You Don't Have To Mean It
3. Rock Me Baby
4. Bitch






Chapters January 18, 2003 - New York, MSG

1. Intro (including Dr. Dre Remix)
2. Street Fighting Man
3. If You Can't Rock Me
4. Don't Stop
5. Monkey Man
6. Angie
7. Let It Bleed
8. Midnight Rambler
9. Thru and Thru
10. Happy
11. You Got Me Rocking
12. Can't You Hear Me Knockin'
13. Honkey Tonk Women
14. (I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
15. It's Only Rock and Roll
16. When The Whip Comes Down
17. Brown Sugar
18. Jumpin' Jack Flash

July 11, 2003 - Paris Olympia

1. Start Me Up
2. Live With Me
3. Neighbours
4. Hand Of Fate
5. No Expectations
6. Worried About You
7. Doo Doo Heartbreaker
8. Stray Cat Blues
9. Dance Part 1
10. Everybody Needs Somebody To Love
11. That's How Strong My Love Is
12. Going To A Go Go
13. The Nearness Of You
14. Before They Make Me Run
15. Love Train
16. Respectable
17. Honkey Tonk Women
18. Brown Sugar
19. Jumpin' Jack Flash

August 24, 2003 - London Twickenham

1. Intro (Neptunes/Sympathy Remix)
2. Brown Sugar
3. You Got Me Rocking
4. Rocks Off
5. Wild Horses
6. Can't Always Get What You Want
7. Paint It Black
8. Tumblin' Dice
9. Slipping Away
10. Sympathy For The Devil
11. Starfucker
12. I Just Want To Make Love To You
13. Street Fighting Man
14. Gimme Shelter
15. Honky Tonk Women
16. (I Can't Get No) Satisfaction
17. Jumpin' Jack Flash


Maybe this doesn't mean anything, but the way the person at IORR described it, he's got the "jam" orders wrong. The tracklisting has "Well, Well" and then "Extreme Western Grip", and he says Keith yells "Extreme Western Grip!!" at the end of Jam #1 and Mick says "Well, well" at the end of Jam #2...........

Could this person at IORR be full of S@#T?
[Edited by Boomy]
10-30-03 08:11 PM
Fiji Joe Well...looking at the Best Buy promo, they don't call em "New songs"...they call em Bootlegs...which tells me that they're unfinished and tentative...Now if Mick is out there saying two new songs....that's a different story
10-30-03 08:12 PM
Fiji Joe Dang Boomy...we on the same wave length or not?
10-30-03 08:16 PM
Boomy Yeah man!

Jason, B & B, Rog and Rerun....it's all on the same wave length!!
10-30-03 08:18 PM
Fiji Joe Rog...now you know that cat was getting tons of poontang
10-30-03 08:26 PM
Boomy Fiji, what the fuck happened to Dushkin??

I went there, and it's flooded with spam!!!

10-30-03 09:11 PM
Fiji Joe I guess all those angry Germans got jobs

Or perhaps it's the revenge of the glamor models
[Edited by Fiji Joe]
10-30-03 10:09 PM
Shockspeeder KEITH
Extreme western grip!



MICK
Well, well.
10-30-03 10:54 PM
Sir Stonesalot OK, so they are listed on the promo materials @ Best Buy as being "The Bootlegs" from the Paris Studio. I also saw the tracks refered to elsewhere as "previously unheard and unreleased". Again, not refered to as new complete songs. In fact, I have seen no official advertising that uses the word "songs". I did see them refered to as "tracks", which they indeed are. And just exactly who gets to say what is and isn't a "song"? Even if the Stones DO refer to these 2 tracks as "songs", that is their perogative as the artists who recorded them. Even so, with all that said, just by looking at the promo material as presented at Bestbuy.com...I'd say that these 2 tracks are probably outtakes.

I do not see anything, anywhere, that says that these 2 tracks are new, complete songs. There is absolutely nothing misleading about it. It is not the fault of the Rolling Stones that people assume things. It is not the fault of the Rolling Stones that some overzealous fans started posting that the new DVD would have 2 new songs on it.

We weren't lied to by the Stones. If we were misled, it was by the people who posted that these were new, finished songs. They assumed something that wasn't there to begin with.

Think what you like. I think it's much ado about nothing.
10-30-03 10:59 PM
muddy As posted on IORR, these 2 new numbers are instrumentals,
basically studio jams. They're not "songs" you will hear them do live, at least in their current form, and you're not going to hear these on the radio as is.
10-30-03 11:19 PM
Sir Stonesalot I just dug through the archives and found our culprit.

>Soldatti wrote:
The new songs will be:
- Well Well
- Extreme Western Grip

look for more on:
http://www.sympathyforthedevils.com/news.htm<

>gotdablouse wrote:
Unless I'm mistaken, there's actually less on that site, they just mention two tracks recorded at Guillaume Tell in 2002.

Is it me or do these sound like "outtake titles" ;-)<

Personally, I think this stems from a language difference. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Soldatti from Argentina, a spanish speaking country? And isn't www.sympathyforthedevils.com a french language site? It's simple to see how the misunderstanding could occur. It's not really Soldatti's fault, he just misinterpreted. Pretty easy to do really.

When gotdablouse looked at the same info on that site he came away with the impression that these were outtakes. And after reading the promo material @ Bestbuy.com, I agree. It reads like these are outtakes.

You can't hold the Stones accountable for people's misinterpretations and assumptions. This advertising is not misleading at all. In fact, it makes more sense for the 2 tracks to be outtakes.

I'd chalk this one up to a language barrier and nothing more.

10-30-03 11:41 PM
Soldatti The "TWO NEW SONGS" are that: TWO NEW SONGS.

If both are outtakes, jams, rehearsals, Keith tuning the guitar or Mick "Goddess..." leftovers I don't know but both are unreleased until now.

This seems "Jamming With Edward" but with Keith this time...
10-31-03 12:04 AM
Sir Stonesalot Yeah, see that's what I mean.

To us english speakers, tracks and songs are 2 different things.

A track denotes a set part of a track list...not necessarily a song. It could be almost anything, studio chatter, an interview snippet, a guy doodling around, a loose jam, an introduction...anything that has a track marker at the beginning and another one at the end. Outtakes are usually refered to as "tracks".

A song is a completely different animal. Keith tuning his guitar is not a song. To us, a song is organized, has structure, usually lyrics as well. It has a organized beginning, verses, refrains, bridges, an ending point. Generally speaking, we do not refer to an unorganized jam as a "song". We call it what it is...a "jam", or an "outtake" or a "track".

Again Soldatti, I am not accusing you of anything wrong. I understand that english is not your first language. We can't expect you to know the subtle difference between a track and a song. For all I know, where you come from, Well Well and Extreme Western Grip would be considered songs...even in their unfinished state. That is not so here though.

Or, are you saying that the info on IORR is wrong? Are you saying that these are NOT instrumental jams at all, and that they are actual structured songs?

10-31-03 12:45 AM
prism What did Keith mean by "extreme western grip"? He knows it's a tennis term. Was he using that particular tennis grip while playing guitar during the jam?
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