| October 16th, 2005 01:33 AM |
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| KeithRichardsWife |
It's good they stopped because they whould do a horrible version of Brown Sugar, That band need's to stick to their crappy song's. |
| October 16th, 2005 11:34 AM |
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| Riffhard |
Alright let me make myself clear here. Fuck Greenday! The Clash my have been about making money and I have absofuckinglutly no problem with that. Greenday has fully embraced their own MTV fake,phoney,eyeliner,pop image and I DO HATE them for it. I hate everything about Greenday,and I hate most people that like them. If you are embraced by the MTV generation chances are you suck. Greenday just proves that theory. There does that work for everybody?!
The Clash had no problem makeing money? Gee ya think?! Go listen to London Calling and then put Greenday's American Idiot. If you can't identify the true sellouts after that then you have no bussiness commenting on the Clash anyway. Making money does not make you a sellout!
Riffhard |
| October 16th, 2005 12:04 PM |
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| Sir Stonesalot |
>DO NOT DOG THE CLASH! They were the only rock and roll band that ever mattered!<
Who was dogging The Clash?
>Mick Jones' pop tendencies are what created their commercial/ dance pop sounding music. There were maybe 3 good songs on Combat Rock and Rock the Casbah was not one of them.<
Dude, you missed my point. Rock The Casbah was a hit. It made the Clash tons of money. It doesn't matter if there are better songs on Combat Rock....Casbah was the big hit. As a hit that made lots of money...it is similar to Blvd of Broken Dreams, no? That was my point dude.
>As a band they were never about making oodles of money.<
I never said they were about making oodles of money. But every single one of them has stated that they were quite happy when they started making good money. None of them actually wanted to keep living in squalid squats forever. Who could blame them? I certainly don't hold it against them. I don't begrudge ANY band or artist their big payday. Good for them.
>Listen to lyrics of their songs, most of them are politically charged rants.<
I'd say "some" is more realistic than "most". They also wrote lots of kiss off songs, love songs, story songs, and social songs...songs about the ills of our society. Sure some were politically charged, but not "most".
>I think Green Day's success has turned them into "rock stars".<
And you don't think that happened to The Clash too?
>Their live show has become much more about the spectacle than the music.<
Geez. Sounds like the Stones....
Now for Riffy...
>Alright let me make myself clear here. Fuck Greenday!<
Yeah, with a sharp stick. You already said that. I pretty sure we all understood you the first time.
>The Clash my have been about making money and I have absofuckinglutly no problem with that.<
Again, I never said they were all about making money...I said that they didn't mind being successful. Subtle difference perhaps, but a big difference none the less.
>Greenday has fully embraced their own MTV fake,phoney,eyeliner,pop image and I DO HATE them for it.<
Oh yeah, right. And The Clash didn't do the same thing? Christ man, Strummer even went with a fuckin' MOHAWK. I understand completely Riffy. It's OK for The Clash to do it, but if the band that did an album calling you an idiot does the same shit...you hate them. Makes sense to me.
>I hate everything about Greenday,and I hate most people that like them.<
Yeah, that says a lot about you man. So I guess you hate me then? That sucks dude.
>If you are embraced by the MTV generation chances are you suck. Greenday just proves that theory. There does that work for everybody?!<
No. I think your theory just shows what a close minded tool you are.
>The Clash had no problem makeing money? Gee ya think?!<
In fact, aside from Brian Jonestown Massacre, I can't think of any band that is dedicated to being adverse to being successful.
>Go listen to London Calling and then put Greenday's American Idiot. If you can't identify the true sellouts after that then you have no bussiness commenting on the Clash anyway. Making money does not make you a sellout!<
You just contradicted yourself bigtime. Making money does not make you a sellout, but since Green Day is making lots of money they are a sellout? You are not making much sense here Riffy. Are you suggesting that Green Day is just taking their political stand just for the sake of making money? You really don't think the mean it? I dunno dude, they sound pretty serious about it to me. Think Steve Earle is just posing for the money too?
But of course, you have to think the way you do, being a good Republican and all. Anyone who does not tow the GOP line must be hated. Dude, you are more transparent that the lids on my new Wolfgang Puck Signature Bistro Series Cookware.
Why don't you just be honest Riffy? If you really hate Green Day because of their surface appearance...their image...then you must be a pretty shallow guy. Since I don't think you are a shallow guy, I must assume that you hate them for something deeper. It can't be the music since there is much more out there that is even more bland and rote than Green Day. It must be something else...like their political stance. Why can't you just admit it? I already told you that I couldn't blame you for hating them since they did an entire album devoted to calling you an idiot. I feel the same about Toby Keith, Alice Cooper, and The Nuge. There's no shame in it man.
[Edited by Sir Stonesalot] |
| October 16th, 2005 04:47 PM |
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| monkey_man |
quote:
Sir Stonesalot wrote:
>DO NOT DOG THE CLASH! They were the only rock and roll band that ever mattered!<
Who was dogging The Clash?
>Mick Jones' pop tendencies are what created their commercial/ dance pop sounding music. There were maybe 3 good songs on Combat Rock and Rock the Casbah was not one of them.<
Dude, you missed my point. Rock The Casbah was a hit. It made the Clash tons of money. It doesn't matter if there are better songs on Combat Rock....Casbah was the big hit. As a hit that made lots of money...it is similar to Blvd of Broken Dreams, no? That was my point dude.
>As a band they were never about making oodles of money.<
I never said they were about making oodles of money. But every single one of them has stated that they were quite happy when they started making good money. None of them actually wanted to keep living in squalid squats forever. Who could blame them? I certainly don't hold it against them. I don't begrudge ANY band or artist their big payday. Good for them.
>Listen to lyrics of their songs, most of them are politically charged rants.<
I'd say "some" is more realistic than "most". They also wrote lots of kiss off songs, love songs, story songs, and social songs...songs about the ills of our society. Sure some were politically charged, but not "most".
>I think Green Day's success has turned them into "rock stars".<
And you don't think that happened to The Clash too?
>Their live show has become much more about the spectacle than the music.<
Geez. Sounds like the Stones....
Green Day filmed the show on Thurs for a DVD. . .when you see it, you'll see how overproduced and self indulgent the show was. (Indoor pyrotechnics that made audience members at the front of the stage pass out from lack of oxygen that the explosions caused!) I've seen Green Day many times from the time that the were the opening act to the present. . .I think I'm qualified to document the change in their show. They have definitely become a "marketable commodity" for the MTV generation. Maybe the Clash flamed out too soon for MTV to do the same to them. I saw them 6 times from 81-85; both with and without Mick Jones and never saw a change in the production of their live shows.
quote:
Geez. Sounds like the Stones....
I'm in full agreement here . . . their shows are huge spectacles. My only point that I was making was that Green Day has crossed over this bridge as well.
MM
[Edited by monkey_man] |
| October 16th, 2005 05:00 PM |
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| monkey_man |
quote:
DAVINO wrote:
I would say that statement is a little off base. They were great, but nowhere near "the only rock and roll band that ever mattered!"
Umm Dude if you knew anything about the Clash you would know that I was only cribbing their own PR releases about themselves! It was sort of tounge in cheek, me saying that.
quote:
Have you ever listened to The Presidents Of The United States Of America, they have great energy!
Britney Spears has a lot of energy too but that don't make her great!
quote:
Phish, IMO, are one of the most genre-bending, brilliant band to come along EVER! Have you listened to them?
LOL! I'll give you that they are creative with their approach to music. I haven't listened to them so much as been subjected to many of their live shows!
[Edited by DAVINO]
[/quote] |
| October 16th, 2005 05:28 PM |
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| deuce |
I like Green Day weather they are on MTV or not. 'Dookie' is a great album. |
| October 16th, 2005 06:48 PM |
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| Sir Stonesalot |
>I saw them 6 times from 81-85; both with and without Mick Jones and never saw a change in the production of their live shows.<
I wasn't talking about their live shows per se...I was talking about The Clash's image. They went from paint spattered overalls with slogans stenciled on...to designer leather pants and $250.00 boots! Man, Joe even went to a mohawk.
>My only point that I was making was that Green Day has crossed over this bridge as well.<
So it's OK for the Stones but not for Green Day?
I don't like double standards.
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| October 16th, 2005 09:15 PM |
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| Prodigal Son |
This isn't to say I don't like Green Day at all, or anymore for that matter. They're still at it, after all. But I think making their next album just as mainstream as this one would be a mistake artistically. They made big cash off of this one, now it's time to do something more artistic and true. Not American Idiot, Pt. 2. They don't need to be writing songs that TV stations can throw onto sports games to enhance the drama or onto lousy teen soap operas (hey, some people like THe O.C. but I don't, although it has its place and is better represented by its humorous outlook than its lame, 90210-lifted storylines). |
| October 17th, 2005 01:42 AM |
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| monkey_man |
quote:
Sir Stonesalot wrote:
So it's OK for the Stones but not for Green Day?
I don't like double standards.
There is no double standard here; the Stones sold out and lost their "street cred" a long time ago. I'm still a fan. I just think it's laughable to count Green Day as a "punk" band. They have always been a punk tribute band in my estimation. Sort of the way the Black Crowes are a Stones tribute band.
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| October 17th, 2005 09:21 AM |
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| Sir Stonesalot |
I agree, I don't think Green Day is a punk band anymore either. The Clash grew out of being a punk band as well. But we can't dog The Clash for it...right? Double standard.
And I don't think the Stones have lost any street cred. At least not in any of the cities that I have visited recently... |
| October 17th, 2005 10:55 AM |
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| Saint Sway |
quote:
Sir Stonesalot wrote:
And I don't think the Stones have lost any street cred.
oh yeah, you harldy ever hear anyone say that the Stones are only in it for the money.
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| October 17th, 2005 01:00 PM |
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| monkey_man |
quote:
Sir Stonesalot wrote:
I agree, I don't think Green Day is a punk band anymore either. The Clash grew out of being a punk band as well. But we can't dog The Clash for it...right? Double standard.
Your rational for attacking my opinion keeps changing so we are just going to have to agree to disagree here. Let's stick to something we can agree on . . .politics! 
MM
[Edited by monkey_man] |
| October 17th, 2005 01:46 PM |
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| Sir Stonesalot |
I'm not attacking anything. I just think we should use the same measuring stick for everyone. I'm also playing devil's advocate.
I just don't understand why we seem to revere some bands, and forgive them for anything(Stones, Clash), yet when Green Day does the same things they are condemned without pause. Why is it that some bands are given a free pass, and others are not? It happens. Everybody does it. I do it. I'm just interested in finding out WHY we do it...other than because we can.
I'm not a Green Day fan. I think they are a one trick pony. As far as I can tell, they only have 2 songs....the crunchy mosh pit hook song, and the sappy introspective acoustic ballad song. I think that is why they are so popular. You know what you are gonna get with them...they are safe. Same reason why people like to eat at McDonalds when they are travelling...the food is always the same. The food is crappy and bad for you...but it's safe because you know what you are gonna get. A Big Mac in Philly tastes like a Big Mac in Detroit that tastes like a Big Mac in Seattle. You see what I'm getting at?
But I'm not going to condemn Green Day for doing the same sort of things that some of my fave bands do. I'll condemn them for being unimaginative in their songwriting and bland in their musicianship...but the rest of it I got no problem with. |
| October 17th, 2005 02:34 PM |
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| voodoopug |
quote:
Saint Sway wrote:
oh yeah, you harldy ever hear anyone say that the Stones are only in it for the money.
EVERY musician/artist is out there for the money....unless they are deciding to play for free, face it, its for the money.
I enjoy my job, but i come here for the money, not for street cred. |
| October 17th, 2005 03:17 PM |
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| pdog |
I alwways thought bands were in for the pussy... The money shows up later if you're lucky, but the pussy can be had out the gate... |
