| 2nd September 2007 12:41 AM |
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| Poison Dart |
I don't know if anyone else caught this or not, but some outlets are reporting that Led Zeppelin may actually be getting together for a few concert (I'll believe it when I see it) dates in England.
This got me thinking. Who is the greater/bigger band The Rolling Stones or Led Zeppelin?
While most people here would argue the point. I think most neutral people would list "The Beatles" as the biggest (I'm not saying the best)band ever,but who is #2? Is it the Stones or Led Leppelin?
There is no question a 2007 Led Zeppelin tour would shatter box office records, they have been out of the game for so long the pent up demand would be overwhelming. Just look how Van Halen (clearly not in the same league as The Stones or Led Zepp)is selling.
On the other hand. In the nearly 30 years since Zeppelin called it quits the Stones have been the dominant force in the concert industry. The Stones just never went away.
To this day the oversaturated (too many big shows too close to each other) Rolling Stones are the only stadium band left in the world.
Demand would be the same for the Stones if say they had broken up after Dirty Work. Does anyone remember what a bitch it was trying to get tix to the "Steel Wheels" tour? They sold out the stadium in my hometown (Boston) three nights in a row. At that point it had only been 8 years since they were on the road.
The point is you couldn't compare 2007 Led Zep sales to the Stones who seem to be here every six months. Despite oversaturating the market and charging $400 plus per ticket the Stones continue to fill stadiums. That fact speaks volumes about the Stones continued popularity and iconic status.
I also think the Stones are "bigger stars" in the mainstream media's eyes. While Page/Plant are well known in rock circles. They are not superstars in the sense that Jagger + to a lesser degree Keith Richards are.
As far as a musical legacy is concerned they are both giants,but I would give the advantage to the Stones. I think most critics would say that the Stones best work is better than the best work of Led Zeppelin.
Album sales would have to go to Led Zeppelin. I believe that every Zeppelin studio record (except maybe their debut album)1 went to #1. They have several records that sold 10 million plus.
The Stones have sold a ton of records (people forget that ABB (a footnote in Stones album history) was the #1 record in the world for two weeks)but they have never really enjoyed the blockbuster sales numbers Led Zeppelin put up.
The Stones were also more influential/revolutionary in the early days. They had more of an impact in shaping the modern rock genre rock and were more of a social force than Led Zeppelin ever was. The Stones played on a bigger social landscape than Led Zeppelin did.
I think it's fairly close,but the Stones would emerge as the bigger/greater band of the two bands when all things are considered.
ps: I wonder how good a Led Zeppelin tour in 2007 would be? I saw Plant/Page a few years back and they kind of sucked. The Stones were much,much better.
[Edited by Poison Dart] |
| 2nd September 2007 12:48 AM |
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| the good |
Stones are by far the more historically/culturally important band. |
| 2nd September 2007 12:52 AM |
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| The Wick |
You're kidding right? Zeppelin are so overrated that it's not even funny. They also inspired some incredibly shite bands that followed them. Individually Page and John Paul Jones are amazing musicians and Bonham could bang away, and Plant has his moments, but when you put it all together it's generally rubbish. And I really don't give a toss what the rock loving groupies think. |
| 2nd September 2007 01:15 AM |
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| mrhipfl |
I'd say the Stones top Zep, but not by much. The Stones are more versatile and more musically diverse. The guys in Zep are more talented musicians. I've never seen Zeppelin live, and have only seen the Stones live during the ABB tour, so I don't know how they compare to each other there. |
| 2nd September 2007 02:26 AM |
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| pdog |
Ramones! |
| 2nd September 2007 02:45 AM |
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| IanBillen |
Stones, by quite a considerable margin at this point.
Led Zepplin had their time. A great run. All 12 years...
Now see The Rolling Stones> All 40 + years. They are the essential building blocks of what rock n roll is, was and has become. Much of this is based on their own contribution in itself.
I know Led Zepplin were a powerful and solid group, but I must say, they, and U2 are very overrated. Always have been.
It is almost impossible to state The Stones as ever being over-rated even though they are that huge. You can't really say The Stones are overrated. Even the non-Stones fan will have to give you that one because of who they are, what they have done, and are still doing. That's enough to seal the deal right there.
Ian
[Edited by IanBillen]
[Edited by IanBillen] |
| 2nd September 2007 03:14 AM |
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| mrhipfl |
quote:
pdog wrote:
Ramones!
For you  :
Rhino has announced a new double DVD set featuring punk pioneers, The Ramones. The set is titled It’s Alive: 1974-1996 and is due out October 02, 2007. This is not to be confused with the band's 1979 live album, also titled It’s Alive.
The DVDs will feature four hours of rare and previously unreleased performances. The disc was supervised by original drummer Tommy Ramone and the sets are arrange chronologically and features more than 100 songs. The DVD also includes previously unreleased footage filmed on New Year’s Eve in 1977 during the band’s incendiary performance at The Rainbow Theatre in London. The entire concert was released in 1979 as the It’s Alive album, considered one of the best live records ever. The DVD features 14 songs in 5.1 Surround Sound taken from the show including “Pinhead,” “We’re A Happy Family,” and “Havana Affair.” Nine performances recorded in 1982 at the US Festival in San Bernardino, CA are also featured here in 5.1 Surround Sound.
Disc 1:
CBGB - New York, NY (9/15/74)
01. Now I Wanna Sniff Some Glue
02. I Don't Wanna Go Down To The Basement
03. Judy Is A Punk Max's Kansas City - New York, NY (4/18/76)
04. I Wanna Be Your Boyfriend
05. 53rd & 3rd The Club - Cambridge, MA (5/12/76)
06. Chain Saw Max's Kansas City - New York, NY (10/8/76)
07. Havana Affair
08. Listen To My Heart My Father's Place - Roslyn, NY (4/13/77)
09. I Remember You
10. Carbona Not Glue CBGB - New York, NY (6/11/77)
11. Blitzkrieg Bop
12. Sheena Is A Punk Rocker
13. Beat On The Brat
14. Now I Wanna Sniff Some Glue
15. Rockaway Beach
16. Cretin Hop
17. Oh Oh I Love Her So
18. Today Your Love, Tomorrow The World The Second Chance - Ann Arbor, MI (6/26/77)
19. Rockaway Beach
20. Carbona Not Glue The Ivanhoe Theater - Chicago, IL (7/6/77)
21. Pinhead
22. Suzy Is A Headbanger The Armadillo - Austin, TX (7/14/77) Early Show
23. Commando
24. I Wanna Be Your Boyfriend The Armadillo - Austin, TX (7/14/77) Late Show
25. Now I Wanna Be A Good Boy
26. 53rd & 3rd
27. Today Your Love, Tomorrow The World Liberty Hall - Houston, TX (7/15/77)
28. Loudmouth
29. I Remember You
30. Gimme Gimme Shock Treatment Liberty Hall - Houston, TX (7/16/77)
31. Oh Oh I Love Her So
32. Today Your Love, Tomorrow The World Don Kirshner's Rock Concert - L.A., CA (8/9/77)
33. Loudmouth
34. Judy Is A Punk
35. Glad To See You Go
36. Gimme Gimme Shock Treatment The Camera Mart Stages - New York, NY (9/3/77)
37. Swallow My Pride
38. Pinhead
39. Sheena Is A Punk Rocker It's Alive, The Rainbow Theatre - London (12/31/77)
40. Blitzkrieg Bop
41. I Wanna Be Well
42. Glad To See You Go
43. You're Gonna Kill That Girl
44. Commando
45. Havana Affair
46. Cretin Hop
47. Listen To My Heart
48. I Don't Wanna Walk Around With You
49. Pinhead
50. Do You Wanna Dance?
51. Now I Wanna Be A Good Boy
52. Now I Wanna Sniff Some Glue
53. We're A Happy Family
Disc 2:
Musikladen - Bremen, Germany (9/13/78)
01. Rockaway Beach
02. Teenage Lobotomy
03. Blitzkrieg Bop
04. Don't Come Close
05. I Don't Care
06. She's The One
07. Sheena Is A Punk Rocker
08. Cretin Hop
09. Listen To My Heart
10. I Don't Wanna Walk A/round With You
11. Pinhead The Old Grey Whistle Test - London (9/19/78)
12. Don't Come Close
13. She's The One
14. Go Mental Top of the Pops - London (9/28/78)
15. Don't Come Close Oakland, CA (12/28/78)
16. I'm Against It
17. Needles And Pins San Francisco Civic Center, S.F., CA (6/9/79)
18. I Want You Around
19. I'm Affected
20. California Sun The Old Grey Whistle Test - London (1/15/78)
21. Rock 'N' Roll High School
22. Do You Remember Rock 'N' Roll Radio? Top of the Pops - London (1/31/80)
23. Baby I Love You Sha Na Na - L.A., CA (5/19/80)
24. Rock 'N' Roll High School Mandagsborsen - Stockholm, Sweden (10/26/81)
25. We Want The Airwaves TVE Musical Express - Madrid, Spain (11/17/81)
26. This Business Is Killing Me
27. All Quiet On The Eastern Front US Festival - San Bernardino, CA (9/3/82)
28. Do You Remember Rock 'N' Roll Radio?
29. Gimme Gimme Shock Treatment
30. Rock 'N' Roll High School
31. I Wanna Be Sedated
32. Beat On The Brat
33. The KKK Took My Baby Away
34. Here Today, Gone Tomorrow
35. Chinese Rocks
36. Teenage Lobotomy The Old Grey Whistle Test - London (2/26/85)
37. Wart Hog
38. Chasing The Night Obras Sanitarias, Buenos Aires, Argentina (2/3/87)
39. Blitzkrieg Bop
40. Freak Of Nature
41. Crummy Stuff
42. Love Kills
43. I Don't Care
44. Too Tough To Die
45. Mama's Boy Provinssirock Festival, Seinajoki, Finland (6/4/88)
46. I Don't Want You Anymore
47. Weasel Face
48. Garden Of Serenity
49. I Just Want To Have Something To Do
50. Surfin' Bird
51. Cretin Hop
52. Somebody Put Something In My Drink
53. We're A Happy Family R.I.T., Rochester, NY (10/8/88)
54. Do You Remember Rock 'N' Roll Radio
55. Wart Hog Rolling Stone Club - Milan, Italy (3/16/92)
56. Psycho Therapy
57. I Believe In Miracles
58. I Wanna Live
59. My Brain Is Hanging Upside Down (Bonzo Goes To Bitburg)
60. Pet Sematary
61. Animal Boy
62. Pinhead Top of the Pops - London (6/29/95)
63. I Don't Wanna Grow Up River Plate Stadium - Estadio Antonio V. Liverti - Buenos Aires, Argentina (3/16/96)
64. I Wanna Be Sedated
65. R.A.M.O.N.E.S.
66. Blitzkrieg Bop |
| 2nd September 2007 03:45 AM |
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| MrPleasant |
Battle of the Bands marketing is for ME!
I vote fot The Stones! What do I get?!?
P.S.: As pdog, I actually vote for the Ramones too, as a matter of fact. |
| 2nd September 2007 04:08 AM |
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| pdog |
quote:
mrhipfl wrote:
For you :
Rhino has announced a new double DVD set featuring punk pioneers, The Ramones. The set is titled It’s Alive: 1974-1996 and is due out October 02, 2007. This is not to be confused with the band's 1979 live album, also titled It’s Alive.
And it is my 40th too! Tell me that I'm not blessed... Bruce, Ramones and a Jagger album... although I will not get the Jagger album. |
| 2nd September 2007 05:34 AM |
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| bilsim |
Stones by miles. Led Zep songs are much too long, and reunions like that very rarely work. To keep going for all this time is half the battle. I doubt Led Zep would be able to last as long as the stones have, nor adapt with the changes in music over time. Imagine and 80s disco Led Zep! |
| 2nd September 2007 07:46 AM |
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| Honky Tonk Man |
At the time, Zeppelin were the biggest rock band on the planet. The Stones just couldn't (and didn't) compete in terms of record sales or the sheer volume who wanted to catch them live.
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| 2nd September 2007 07:47 AM |
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| andrews27 |
Too many Zeppelin haters with their HDs full of Zep from Dime...
[Edited by andrews27] |
| 2nd September 2007 08:15 AM |
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| corgi37 |
Zep have outsold the Stones by such a huge margin, there is no comparision.
However, if ABBA reformed, they would shatter all records. Particulary in Europe & Oz. |
| 2nd September 2007 08:22 AM |
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| Honky Tonk Man |
quote:
corgi37 wrote:
However, if ABBA reformed, they would shatter all records. Particulary in Europe & Oz.
I agree actually. There can’t be too many households in the UK that don’t own a copy of Abba Gold! |
| 2nd September 2007 09:40 AM |
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| Gazza |
quote:
Poison Dart wrote:
This got me thinking. Who is the greater/bigger band The Rolling Stones or Led Zeppelin?
'Greater' and 'bigger' are two different arguments
'Greater' is a matter of opinion. For me, it's the Stones, naturally.
'Bigger' is a statement of fact. Zeppelin. Absolutely no question. Even in the 21st century despite having split up a quarter of a century earlier, their archive releases are bigger sellers than pretty much anyone else. Their record sales are staggering for a band who only released 8 studio albums, 1 album of left overs, 2 live albums plus a few compilations issued since 1990.
And not having toured for 27 years (and not having played the US since 1977), if they were to go on the road again, they really could just name their price.
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| 2nd September 2007 09:41 AM |
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| Gazza |
quote:
pdog wrote:
And it is my 40th too! Tell me that I'm not blessed... Bruce, Ramones and a Jagger album... although I will not get the Jagger album.
Dylan 3-CD compilation also out the same day! |
| 2nd September 2007 09:43 AM |
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| Gazza |
quote:
IanBillen wrote:
Stones, by quite a considerable margin at this point.
Led Zepplin had their time. A great run. All 12 years...
Now see The Rolling Stones> All 40 + years. They are the essential building blocks of what rock n roll is, was and has become. Much of this is based on their own contribution in itself.
I know Led Zepplin were a powerful and solid group, but I must say, they, and U2 are very overrated. Always have been.
It is almost impossible to state The Stones as ever being over-rated even though they are that huge. You can't really say The Stones are overrated. Even the non-Stones fan will have to give you that one because of who they are, what they have done, and are still doing. That's enough to seal the deal right there.
Ian
I believe the thread title asked who is 'bigger' - not who is the most 'overrated' |
| 2nd September 2007 09:54 AM |
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| Egbert |
With 5 core members to Zep's 4, Stones are clearly the bigger band. |
| 2nd September 2007 10:13 AM |
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| Egbert |
And that's not even taking the current entourage (Chuck, Blondie, Bernard, Lisa etc) into account. Will Zep tour with an entourage of their own?
[Edited by Egbert] |
| 2nd September 2007 10:19 AM |
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| gimmekeef |
I think the Stones longevity and continued touring has slightly diminished their stature.Imagine if Stones quit after the 75 Tour...with the run of albums to Some Girls...And there was word today they were going to re-form and tour?....Would make this Zep rumour pale in comparison. |
| 2nd September 2007 10:21 AM |
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| BONOISLOVE |
Led WHAT?? |
| 2nd September 2007 10:37 AM |
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| the good |
quote:
Gazza wrote:
'Greater' and 'bigger' are two different arguments
'Greater' is a matter of opinion. For me, it's the Stones, naturally.
'Bigger' is a statement of fact. Zeppelin. Absolutely no question. Even in the 21st century despite having split up a quarter of a century earlier, their archive releases are bigger sellers than pretty much anyone else. Their record sales are staggering for a band who only released 8 studio albums, 1 album of left overs, 2 live albums plus a few compilations issued since 1990.
And not having toured for 27 years (and not having played the US since 1977), if they were to go on the road again, they really could just name their price.
When you say bigger I translate that as being more popular. I don't think Zep is more popular at all. Maybe every snotty suburban white kid in America has all thier albums, but the Stones hold their own in record sales, had many more hits than zep ever did, and they are huge global icons. Just as an anecdote, my friend went to a remote location in turkey last year for some of his grad work. He was out in the middle of NOWHERE. He was looking for a place to find directions when he came across this bar that was a monument to the Stones. He said it was the funniest thing he has ever seen. In the middle of the Turkish mountains, he sees the lips and tounge and hears jumpin jack flask blasting from the place. My sister was in Singapore last year wearing her stones t shirt. Like every kid she went by said "Stones!" and gave her a thumbs up. Now its true, these are just anecdotes, but I don't think Zep has that kind of mass appeal. |
| 2nd September 2007 10:40 AM |
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| Left Shoe Shuffle |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
pdog wrote:
And it is my 40th too! Tell me that I'm not blessed... Bruce, Ramones and a Jagger album... although I will not get the Jagger album.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
Gazza wrote:
Dylan 3-CD compilation also out the same day!
Fogerty's Revival, too!
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| 2nd September 2007 10:43 AM |
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| Gazza |
quote:
the good wrote:
When you say bigger I translate that as being more popular. I don't think Zep is more popular at all. Maybe every snotty suburban white kid in America has all thier albums, but the Stones hold their own in record sales, had many more hits than zep ever did, and they are huge global icons.
The Stones arent even close to Zeppelin in record sales. Using the RIAA figures alone (and this is just for the US), Zeppelin's album sales are 109.5 million (4th behind The Beatles, Elvis and Garth Brooks(!)) and the Stones are 11th with 66 million.
http://www.riaa.com/goldandplatinumdata.php?table=tblTopArt
Zeppelin's worldwide album sales are estimated at 300 million. source - http://www.led-zeppelin.com/news/vh1_9.14.06.html
Its hard to quantify how many the Stones have sold (maybe Soldatti could help) but I'd guess its in the 200-250 million range.
The Stones certainly had more 'hits' but thats something to do with the fact that (with a few exceptions in the US), Led Zeppelin refused to issue singles.
I'd agree with what you say about the Stones being bigger 'icons' but thats not really the same thing. Every day now I see teenage kids walking around town or in work wearing a 'vintage' Stones tongue t-shirt. Any time I've spoken to any of them and remarked on their shirt, they've either let me know "its a Stones tongue you know" (like theyve discovered something no one should know) or said that they just liked the shirt and arent really fans. Not a single one of them said they were going to see the Stones in Ireland this summer.
[Edited by Gazza] |
| 2nd September 2007 10:48 AM |
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| gimmekeef |
Cant dispute the sales numbers...but ABBA/Jacko/etc sold a ton of shit too...Generally overall though it seems to come down to Beatles...then Stones...then a slight drop to Zep/Who/Floyd/U2/Dylan/Springsteen..in no particular order |
| 2nd September 2007 10:51 AM |
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| Fiji Joe |
quote:
gimmekeef wrote:
Cant dispute the sales numbers...but ABBA/Jacko/etc sold a ton of shit too...Generally overall though it seems to come down to Beatles...then Stones...then a slight drop to Zep/Who/Floyd/U2/Dylan/Springsteen..in no particular order
McDonald's has sold more hamburgers than anyone....who here thinks their the best hamburgers?...Sober people I mean |
| 2nd September 2007 10:57 AM |
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| BONOISLOVE |
Britney Spears is greater than those Led what-what-something-something. Just ask your children, and then tell them to purchase out latest CD, and to watch the telly for a wonderful evening. |
| 2nd September 2007 11:00 AM |
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| the good |
quote:
Gazza wrote:
The Stones arent even close to Zeppelin in record sales. Using the RIAA figures alone (and this is just for the US), Zeppelin's album sales are 109.5 million (4th behind The Beatles, Elvis and Garth Brooks(!)) and the Stones are 11th with 66 million.
http://www.riaa.com/goldandplatinumdata.php?table=tblTopArt
Zeppelin's worldwide album sales are estimated at 300 million. source - http://www.led-zeppelin.com/news/vh1_9.14.06.html
Its hard to quantify how many the Stones have sold (maybe Soldatti could help) but I'd guess its in the 200-250 million range.
The Stones certainly had more 'hits' but thats something to do with the fact that (with a few exceptions in the US), Led Zeppelin refused to issue singles.
I'd agree with what you say about the Stones being bigger 'icons' but thats not really the same thing. Every day now I see teenage kids walking around town or in work wearing a 'vintage' Stones tongue t-shirt. Any time I've spoken to any of them and remarked on their shirt, they've either let me know "its a Stones tongue you know" (like theyve discovered something no one should know) or said that they just liked the shirt and arent really fans. Not a single one of them said they were going to see the Stones in Ireland this summer.
[Edited by Gazza]
Yeah, zep sold more records in the states. But I doubt they have sold a ton more than the stones world wide.
Your point about Zep and not having as many hits because they didn't release more singles holds true (in reverse) for the Stones. I have always thought the reason they didn't sell as many albums is because the released so many singles. |
| 2nd September 2007 11:01 AM |
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| Gazza |
quote:
gimmekeef wrote:
Cant dispute the sales numbers...but ABBA/Jacko/etc sold a ton of shit too...Generally overall though it seems to come down to Beatles...then Stones...then a slight drop to Zep/Who/Floyd/U2/Dylan/Springsteen..in no particular order
You forgot Elvis!
Dylan and The Who arent anywhere near those other acts in terms of sales figures
The Eagles, Michael Jackson, ABBA, Elton and Pink Floyd have also sold in much greater numbers worldwide.
Not to mention the likes of "non rock" acts such as Sinatra, Crosby, Garth Brooks, Streisand etc. Some of these acts maybe havent sold as hugely in markets like the US (ABBA for example) but are still one of the biggest selling acts ever.
Remember also we're limiting ourselves to 'western' popular music. No doubt there are acts in Asia for example who have sold in huge numbers as well, but who we've never heard of.
[Edited by Gazza] |
| 2nd September 2007 11:02 AM |
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| Gazza |
quote:
the good wrote:
Yeah, zep sold more records in the states. But I doubt they have sold a ton more than the stones world wide.
Your point about Zep and not having as many hits because they didn't release more singles holds true (in reverse) for the Stones. I have always thought the reason they didn't sell as many albums is because the released so many singles.
The Stones certainly WOULDNT have sold 300 million worldwide.
The Stones havent really been a major singles act since the late 60's, with a couple of exceptions. |
