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Topic: Ways to stop terrorism, any ideas? Return to archive Page: 1 2 3
July 10th, 2005 02:30 PM
jb
quote:
telecaster wrote:
Christ jb, you of all people!

You aren't glad that 10 millions Iraqs kids are NOW NOT being taught to kill Israelis and that Israel must be destroyed at all costs?

The vast majority of people in Iraq don't know there are other planets or things called "oceans" and can't do math. Why?

Because all Saddam wanted them to learn was how to hate Israel and the west from birth and that Israel must be destroyed from the face of the earth

Now that will all change

As did Saddam paying $25,000 for each PLO suicide bomber in Israel

Sometimes jb you amaze me. I guess this is why we have wars every 20 years. Some people have short memories

Enjoy the sunroof in your BMW today as your drive to the Synagogue. Or are you driving the Porsche? Or does your wife have the kids in the Mercedes today?
[Edited by telecaster]

Hello Tele,
I agree that the world is a better place without Saddam. And what you said regarding Israel, as you know, particularly hits home with me. I am just not sure we took the right path to eliminating Al-Queda. It seems while we were fighting in Iraq, Iran, Syria, N.Korea and China have become even more dangerous. I also think that Bushes cutting 50 billion in homeland security in the next budget is puzzling? I also agree that you can never stop Islamist Fundamnetalists bent on our destruction-my point is, are we going after them in Iraq?
[Edited by jb]
July 10th, 2005 02:38 PM
lotsajizz
quote:
telecaster wrote:

You aren't glad that 10 millions Iraqs kids are NOW NOT being taught to kill Israelis and that Israel must be destroyed at all costs?


]




they're still being taught that...and will for the forseeable future

Iraq is a fake country..always was....lines drawn on a map in Versailles in 1919 by the evil Winnie that made no sense to those many nations divided up by yet more stupid Western politicians...divvy it all up NOW...Kurds get Kurdistan, Sunnis get theres, Shi'ites get theres....but as long as we seek to prop up this fake thing called "Iraq" the problems will continue
July 10th, 2005 02:41 PM
telecaster
quote:
Ten Thousand Motels wrote:


NOW THAT IS FUCKING BULLSHIT.
ABSOLUTE FUCKING BULLSHIT.
If you had ever done your fucking homework you'd KNOW THAT Iraq is quite well educated and advanced.




If you had done your fucking homework you would know THAT IRAQ USED TO BE EDUCATED AND ADVANCED UNTIL SADDAM TOOK OVER!!!!!!

It used to be a center for math and science.

HOW COULD IT BE EDUCATED WHEN SADDAM CLOSED THE SCHOOLS AND THE ONLY BOOKS THE KIDS COULD READ WERE ANTI-ISRAEL
AND HOWE GREAT SADDAM IS???

Pull out Time Magazine from two weeks ago and the article is in their explaining it and do your fucking homework

July 10th, 2005 02:49 PM
maumau first, nanker thanks for the argument
second, can you be more explicit about it because i don't understand what you mean and what i understand reminds me a lot of my first post here

quote:
it is a fact that terrorist leaders are not poor people grown up in muslim villages, on the contrary they represent elite groups, they grew up in western countries and studied in out universities.


to jb

[quote]jb wrote:
It appears that we all agree that terrorism is not going to stop, but disagree on the means to obviate it. Our friends on the right beleieve in pre-emtive strikes and or expanding the war on terror. Our friends on the left feel only through engagement and political means, can we achieve a solution.

this is exactly the cul the sac i was pointing at.
but i don't equal pacifists = political means.
pacifists usually don't understand that time is a key factor, that time in certain circumstances can kill more than bombs.

as it happened in former jugoslavia at the beginning of the nineties
we waited (wasted) years doing "politics" with milosevic and pacifists were happy because they could hide behind the "humanitarian aid to the victims" without taking sides

meanwhile milosevic men kept on killing people

i was not happy at all with that "politics" that was done too late while blood was flowing
i supported the use of force against milosevic

and, as jb, supported war against saddam. me, not because i have ever believed of WMD or Saddam as a supporter of terrorist (hey Telecaster should wage war on sudi arabia, iran or siria if you really want that!) but just because of him being a dictator and for the example that could have been done to the other dictators of the area. Freedom and democracy is possible in the ME also so...change your regimes before i change you...

change, exactly Telecaster, is the issue
to me it is very naif when you say "now it will all change"

i beg your pardon but i don't see it coming
and while i think that sure enough now that saddam is no more there, there's a hope and a chance for iraqi people to change for the better
i also think that a huuge amount of mistakes has been made and that there is a serious risk that the war with its horrible numbers of deaths and injuried could fail its goal


July 10th, 2005 02:53 PM
Ten Thousand Motels
quote:
telecaster wrote:
HOW COULD IT BE EDUCATED WHEN SADDAM CLOSED THE SCHOOLS AND THE ONLY BOOKS THE KIDS COULD READ WERE ANTI-ISRAEL
AND HOWE GREAT SADDAM IS???



Another factual inaccuracy and mis-characherization. There's good reason that I have no hope.
July 10th, 2005 02:56 PM
telecaster
quote:
Ten Thousand Motels wrote:


Another factual inaccuracy and mis-characherization. There's good reason that I have no hope.



They don't show that on www.antiwar.com?

Do you look at anything else besides that site?

CORRECTION: In my prior post I said "people" when I should have said "kids"

Ya TenK, Iraq was a paradise.
July 10th, 2005 09:28 PM
FPM C10
quote:
telecaster wrote:


They don't show that on www.antiwar.com?

Do you look at anything else besides that site?

CORRECTION: In my prior post I said "people" when I should have said "kids"

Ya TenK, Iraq was a paradise.



What the fuck are you doing in this thread? Your ideas about fighting terrorism are being implemented by the Bush administration.

In another thread you said you were going to apologize when they took the Brian header down. It's down. What's up? Was that a LIE?

You're such a fucking asshole.

My two cents for this thread - there is no solution. The world's full of assholes. The sooner they wipe the slate clean the better.
July 11th, 2005 04:07 AM
FotiniD Brian May of Queen has put it quite well, I think, on his on-line journal (http://www.brianmay.com/brian/brianssb/brianssb.html). A part of it:

Every time I fly (which is almost almost every day right now !) I walk past the conspicuous plastic case of confiscated nail clippers and tiny scissors, and think to myself ..."are we really fooling ourselves that by doing this we are making our world safe? " Yesterday in London must have shown us that we have no hope of solving the "Terrorist Problem" with this kind of sticking plaster. So where do we go from here ? Search everyone before they go on a bus? On a tube train ? Walking down the street? This is the road to insanity .... a climate of fear, which, sadly, the USA is already experiencing. It's time we attacked the cause rather than the symptoms. I want to see our politicians answer the question "WHY?" WHY do people hate us this much? What can we do to change this? It's no use thinking we are dealing with a small bunch of maniacs, as seems to be the popular view, who need to be "stamped out". The reality is we are looking at a large number of entire countries of people to whom the American (and English) flag is a symbol of evil. Of selfishness and bullying imperialist aggression. THIS is what we must address. This is what we owe it to our children to do. In my opinion.

July 11th, 2005 04:13 AM
pdog Nuke The North and South Poles.
Problem solved.
July 11th, 2005 07:48 AM
Taptrick
I believe: Brian May's questioning why people hate his people so much is akin to wondering why Charles Manson hated Sharon Tate. It doesn't matter why. It's wrong and understanding or appeasement sends an inappropriate message of tolerance that has often, throughout history, only encouraged similar behavior. Brian has forgotten that their warped view of their religion ultimately requires his conversion or death. A person, race, or culture can only be responsible for their own actions. It's basic rational emotive therapy on a larger scale. I can't make someone happy. It is only THEIR OWN thoughts and interpretations of events that make them unhappy.



July 11th, 2005 07:53 AM
Taptrick
By the way though, Brian has a great web site. I love his use of stero-positioned photography. I shall check back often I disagree with him but he is a very good read.

July 11th, 2005 07:59 AM
FotiniD
quote:
Taptrick wrote:

I believe: Brian May's questioning why people hate his people so much is akin to wondering why Charles Manson hated Sharon Tate. It doesn't matter why. It's wrong and understanding or appeasement sends an inappropriate message of tolerance that has often, throughout history, only encouraged similar behavior. Brian has forgotten that their warped view of their religion ultimately requires his conversion or death. A person, race, or culture can only be responsible for their own actions. It's basic rational emotive therapy on a larger scale. I can't make someone happy. It is only THEIR OWN thoughts and interpretations of events that make them unhappy.




I'm not so sure that terrorism is purely led by a hatred of christianity or other religions for that matter. Sure enough, it may be a motive for many of the terrorists involved, but I think the motivations are deeper than that - and I'm certain that those organizations' leaders have other stuff in mind apart from converting us all to Islam. Definitely.

But I think what Brian wonders here is what indeed makes a man wake up one day, wear a jacket full of explosives and take the tube? What makes a man plant bombs in a bus? I think it has to do with despair. Think of a person that his family was killed during a war in which the USA or UK were involved for instance. What is left for this man in the world? Combine this with his living conditions and you got a man in despair - and he won't hesitate in doing what he's doing.

So I think we should indeed address the "why's" if we're to find a solution to this problem. Otherwise, hate breeds hate and we're only going to end up with innocents being killed, both sides.
July 11th, 2005 08:30 AM
Taptrick
Good post. Sure there's other things involved: hatred of the idea of female equality, hatred of the freedom to choose to not fully cover a body in dress, hatred of the idea of the freedom to choose a morality different than theirs...all come to mind. And if there are others ideas in the leaders minds, it is a mute point, the children have "formally" been taught to hate since as early as 1969. They kill for the reasons stated. And I don't so much see these reasons as being focused against Christianity but more focused on western civilization and Christianity just axiomatically becomes a part of that. I don't believe any amount of understanding is going to lead to anything. One side will always believe the other doesn't have the right to commit terrorism while the other will continue to believe they do have the right to impose values related to gender, religion, choice, and economics. Religion must be separated from government worldwide before any movement towards true freedom can begin.

July 11th, 2005 08:39 AM
Maxlugar Nanky has already solved it. It's over folks!
July 11th, 2005 09:33 AM
nankerphelge Man that's even more beautiful than I could have ever imagined!

Love the flower!
July 11th, 2005 09:49 AM
Maxlugar [quote]nankerphelge wrote:
Man that's even more beautiful than I could have ever imagined!

Love the flower!



What about the heart-shaped head?! Do you like that? This guy is all Love.

If you have any ideas for solar panels I'm all ears.
July 11th, 2005 09:55 AM
Jumping Jack 3 Suggestions to Mitigate Some of the Threats Posed By Terrorists

1. Deal with the problem in a serious fashion. Populations, their elected leaders and the media they financially support need to make mitigating terrorism their top concern. It needs to be more important than the importation of cheap labor, more important than playing politics, more important than philosophical debates over less important issues like abortion and taxation. Seal off the borders and limit immigration to only those who can add something of great worth to a nation.

2. Adopt a zero tolerance policy toward mass murderers. When people threaten mass murder on a website, in a mosque, or in a public forum they should be given an immediate life sentence, no chance of parole. Not at Club Gitmo either, in a hard labor camps or prisons with the likes of Charles Manson. Quit the excuse making, coddling, understanding and appeasement. Isolate them where they can do no further harm.

3. Make gathering intelligence and protecting your families a higher priority than protecting civil liberties. 3000 deaths resulted in the Patriot Act, much like adding a stop sign after an accident at an intersection. How many does deaths does it the to further strengthen the Patriot Act and force our legal system to protect our interests rather than those of mass murderers? 100,000 in NY after a dirty bomb? 1,000,000 after a nuke in LA?

Sadly, those like Clinton who favor appeasement, who gamble that the problem will go away on it's own and the mass murderes won't plan a second attack on the WTC, do so with your families lives as well as their own. It is time the world held these irresponsible people accountible for their poor decision making.
July 11th, 2005 10:04 AM
telecaster Good post JJ. Look at these two quotes from the current Mayor of London. He invites a terrorist to visit him calling him a "scholar of great respect"

Meanwhile he calls Bush "the greatest threat to life on this planet"

Folks, we aren't reading from the same book much less the same page. Let me know if anyone wants the links:


"Last summer, London Mayor Ken Livingstone received Yusuf al-Qaradawi, the main religious authority of the Muslim Brotherhood, which has spawned such movements as al-Qaida and Hamas, to his City Hall, referring to him as "an Islamic scholar of great respect." This "scholar" to whom Livingstone gushed, "You are truly, truly welcome," is a bit of a liberal in Islamist circles. He believes that both men and women should strive to become suicide bombers in the name of jihad."

And then......

"Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, launched a stinging attack on President George Bush last night, denouncing him as the "greatest threat to life on this planet that we've most probably ever seen".


Let us know when you guys get serious about terror

Until then....duck and cover

[Edited by telecaster]
July 11th, 2005 10:05 AM
nankerphelge The heart shaped head is great too -- I think you could easily put a series of high-yield photoelectric cells in the heart shaped head and there is more than enough energy to let the hug-bot go to town all over the middle east.

The hug-bot tour!
Coming to a mosque near you!
July 11th, 2005 10:13 AM
Jumping Jack So who is going to hold the Mayor accountible? He has plenty of blood on his hands as do many other poiliticians. Is this crap acceptable to you? Are you willing to watch other innocents are slaughtered while people like this act on your behalf to protect your families? For what, to bring in cheap labor you are too good or lazy to do yourselves?
July 11th, 2005 10:18 AM
Gazza "Red Ken" Livingstone has a long track record in trying to 'understand' or 'sympathise' with terrorists when they're bombing the shit out of his country and his city.

Hearing his weasel words of condemnation last Thursday was nauseating. Hypocritical fucker
[Edited by Gazza]
July 11th, 2005 10:23 AM
Maxlugar [quote]nankerphelge wrote:
The heart shaped head is great too -- I think you could easily put a series of high-yield photoelectric cells in the heart shaped head and there is more than enough energy to let the hug-bot go to town all over the middle east.



Great. I'll start on that immediately. I'm thinking Care Bear-shaped high-yield photoelectric cells, no?

His arms are telescopic so as to elongate for group hugs. Look out Mullah Omar!

Also, he smells like Rainbows.


[Edited by Maxlugar]
July 11th, 2005 10:30 AM
jb I just pray for a safer world for our children. As a soon to be middle-aged man, my better days are over, but having two beautiful boys, I hope they are able to live as I did in my youth, traveling freely, enjoying various cultures, and not constantly in fear.
July 11th, 2005 10:35 AM
Jumping Jack As an attorney you must make their safety your top priority, particularly considering you live in a state preferred by mass murders for their training activities.
July 11th, 2005 11:07 AM
FPM C10
quote:
Jumping Jack wrote:
3 Suggestions to Mitigate Some of the Threats Posed By Terrorists

1. Deal with the problem in a serious fashion.






quote:
Jumping Jack wrote:
2. Adopt a zero tolerance policy toward mass murderers. When people threaten mass murder on a website, in a mosque, or in a public forum they should be given an immediate life sentence, no chance of parole. Not at Club Gitmo either, in a hard labor camps or prisons with the likes of Charles Manson. Quit the excuse making, coddling, understanding and appeasement. Isolate them where they can do no further harm.



nanker wrote:
Just as a point of clarification, I don't believe I ever said bomb an entire country back to the Stone age.

I think I just said nuke Syria, Iran, No. Korea and maybe some others. Tit for tat. And it wasn't meant to be a joke -- I have always believed that when someone strikes you, you strike back -- harder and meaner!! These terrorists like to hide in these countries and then claim that they act independently -- that it is not state sponsored. That is pure crap and these countries ought to be held accountable. If that means dropping a tactcal nuke in downtown Damascus -- so be it!

Those are rules they want to play by?
Let's fucking play!!!

*****

Or...I'm sorry! Do your proposed rules only cover the mass murder of Americans? Or Christians? Is it only mass murder if the nuke is in a suitcase, but it's okay if it's dropped from a really expensive airplane built specifically for the purpose?

You need to be a lot more specific on this one. The way you have it worded right now is problematic. I'd hate to see Nanky getting boiled alive in Uzbekistan for something that is perfectly sane and acceptable.



quote:
Jumping Jack wrote:

3. Make gathering intelligence and protecting your families a higher priority than protecting civil liberties. 3000 deaths resulted in the Patriot Act, much like adding a stop sign after an accident at an intersection. How many does deaths does it the to further strengthen the Patriot Act and force our legal system to protect our interests rather than those of mass murderers? 100,000 in NY after a dirty bomb? 1,000,000 after a nuke in LA?




Absolutely. The best way to PROTECT America is to destroy it. Then nobody will want to destroy it because it's already destroyed!

Well under way!



quote:
Jumping Jack wrote:

Sadly, those like Clinton who favor appeasement, who gamble that the problem will go away on it's own and the mass murderers won't plan a second attack on the WTC, do so with your families lives as well as their own. It is time the world held these irresponsible people accountible for their poor decision making.




Yeah, that damn Clinton. Hey don't forget about the blowjobs!

I'm all for holding people accountable for poor decision making. Right now those people are generally given a Medal of Freedom and a cabinet post.

Er...I guess you mean DEMOCRATS should be held accountable for poor decision making.
July 11th, 2005 11:53 AM
nankerphelge "I'd hate to see Nanky getting boiled alive in Uzbekistan"

Oh I'm pretty sure you'd pay good money to see that at this point!!



July 11th, 2005 12:07 PM
FPM C10
quote:
nankerphelge wrote:
"I'd hate to see Nanky getting boiled alive in Uzbekistan"

Oh I'm pretty sure you'd pay good money to see that at this point!!







Not at all.

I'd much rather hear why your ideas about bombing cities AREN'T terroristic than hear your hilarious jokes, as funny as they are.


I don't know if you heard, but depending on your answer, Tele's giving me a pair of floor seats for a Stones show! He is a man of his word and I'm sure he would never back out on a promise.
July 11th, 2005 12:51 PM
nankerphelge I never said "hey wouldn't it be cool to go kill a bunch of innocent Muslims because they have no right to exist"

What I did say was that if the Islamic nut jobs shouldn't be able to have it both ways -- kill our innocents and then hide among their own to protect themselves. The countries that harbor and foster these groups are known. I think they should be treated accordingly.

I am not advocating a first strike to prevent little Abdul from growing up to be a terrorist.

However, next time I was holding hands with the Saudi king, I think I'd take the time to inform him of my proposed response should a whole bunch of his countrymen decide once again to fly planes into my buildings.

July 11th, 2005 01:41 PM
FPM C10
quote:
nankerphelge wrote:
I never said "hey wouldn't it be cool to go kill a bunch of innocent Muslims because they have no right to exist"




I'm sorry! Did I say that you did? Must've been talking in my sleep again.


quote:
nankerphelge wrote:
What I did say was that if the Islamic nut jobs shouldn't be able to have it both ways -- kill our innocents and then hide among their own to protect themselves. The countries that harbor and foster these groups are known. I think they should be treated accordingly.



And the people who live there should be atomized, to strike fear into the population, perhaps (at best) in hopes of them forcing their governments into effecting political change. And that is NOT terrorism because...help me out here...

Obviously the terrorists in question place no value on human life - theirs, ours, or the innocents among whom they hide. So your plan would have no effect on THEM, except perhaps to send them off to the paradise their fairy tales promise them. It would just a) kill a bunch of innocent people and b)foster yet another few generations of hatred against the west.

However, it WOULD look AWESOME on the Fox News coverage, and I'm sure it would make the guy who ordered it feel quite manly.


quote:
nankerphelge wrote:
I am not advocating a first strike to prevent little Abdul from growing up to be a terrorist.




No, because pre-emptive strikes against countries that piss you off would be terrorism.


quote:
nankerphelge wrote:
However, next time I was holding hands with the Saudi king, I think I'd take the time to inform him of my proposed response should a whole bunch of his countrymen decide once again to fly planes into my buildings.





Holding HANDS? With a GUY? Howe GAY!

You're just talking crazy talk now, Nanky. Not only that, but it doesn't show the proper respect for the President of the United States and his boytoy. You wanna get rendered?


You still haven't shown me any clear distinction between your plan and terrorism. If it's the retaliatory angle, well, most of the terrorists have some gripe or another that they trot out as an excuse. I believe this latest senseless, inexcusable, cowardly act in London was supposedly in retaliation for civilian deaths in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Before I am lambasted again for being a friend of al-Qaeda, I will state outright that I do not support, condone, or agree with ANY terrorists or terrorists acts, theirs OR yours.

And I really think you're just talking out your ass. Although the acts you advocate ARE terrorist acts - and therefore win me two floor seats to a Rolling Stones show courtesy of my generous friend Tele - I will cut you some slack and say you're not REALLY a terrorist unless you act on your insane plan, and I doubt you have the ways and means to do that.

I'm being REALLY lenient, because what you suggest clearly falls within Jumpin Jack's Suggestion #2 to Mitigate Some of the Threats Posed By Terrorists, viz: threatening mass murder on a website.
July 11th, 2005 01:43 PM
Child of the Moon Just give everyone a copy of Exile and call it good. Things will fix themselves.
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