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| tDice pimp |
Hello. I am sorry if this topic has already been posted, I'm new here.
Something that always seemed weird for me was Ron's lack of effort and sound during the bridges tour. Possibly I am wrong, but it didn't seem or sound like Ronnie to me. First, I think that Ron "overuses" his stratocaster, the Strat sound has always seemed "not stones-like" to me (unlike the powerful sound of keith's telecasters) and maybe Keith should use more gibson guitars (but that's another topic, isn't it?). And second, Was Ron awake during the tour? He dances more than he plays (with significant exceptions of course). He seemed like a better guitarrist before that tour, It's hard for me to believe that the "bridges tour Ronnie Wood" is the same Ron from the 81-82 shows.
--Sorry if my english is hard to understand, it's been a while since the last time I wrote something as long as this in english, but I think you'll understand what I meant.--
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| BILL PERKS |
HE WAS A PHYSICAL WRECK,OUT OF CONTROL DRINKING,AMD HIS BANDMATES DROP HINTS ALL OVER ABOUT IT.NOW HE'S BACK,KICKIN KEEF UP THE ARSE EACH NIGHT. |
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| exile |
really? what hints were they dropping?
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| dealer squealing |
His band members should have give him some coke to snort, and tell him to play the f#""ing guitar. He was not sober on the 1981-2 tour and dosn�t even member a great parts of the tour according to himself but he did play the guitar. From the Steel Wheels tour wich he was playing well ,although he was playing much less then he used to, and on the VL and BTB he was more into saying hello to the crowd than playing the strato.
Less is not more to Ronnie! |
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| beer |
no he's not kicking keith in the ass every night. it's more like two people riding a bike at the same time, ones peddling while the other's coasting. NOT on every song though, no way. but there's still some questionable shit. |
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| Zack |
The Paradiso show in 95 is what amazes me. Ronnie was not only on form and participating, he was brilliant! Like, best he's ever been. How come?
Maybe they scored some righteous blow in Amsterdam, but that seems far fetched, considering the history of his nostrils. |
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| Diedre |
This may all be true, but -- isn't that why they chose Ron as their second guitarist in the first place? They didn't want someone to show them up. Just show up. A team player, even if he's standing around and sitting on the bench at the same time. |
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| nankerphelge |
The suggestion that Ronnie was hired as window dressing is quite an insult to a talented guy. Listen to '75 and especially '78 and it is clear that he had a chemistry with Keith that was incredible -- not merely sitting back and coasting. '81 and '97, and even '99 he was MIA. A lot of people say he was MIA in '94 too -- I didn't see/hear it -- I thought he was very good on VL as well as the '95 shows. And I thought he did great this time out as well.
He's sure had his share of problems over the years -- but this ain't a fucking bunch of choir boys...guitarist for the Stones is laced with occupational hazards!!! |
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| tDice pimp |
This may all be true, but -- isn't that why they chose Ron as their second guitarist in the first place? They didn't want someone to show them up. Just show up. A team player, even if he's standing around and sitting on the bench at the same time.
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Diedre
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No Stone should sit o the bench during a gig, not even if the members of the audience were fucking Toto fans |
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| Martini |
The decline of Ron Wood has been a pretty sad story in the band�s history. He is the only core member whose performance has become markedly worse with age.
Even on the current tour, it is apparent that his playing is far below his performances from �75 to �82 (or even �89-�90, for that matter). He must have ingested so many chemicals over the years that he forgot how to play. |
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| LadyJane |
quote:
Martini wrote:
Even on the current tour, it is apparent that his playing is far below his performances from �75 to �82 (or even �89-�90, for that matter). He must have ingested so many chemicals over the years that he forgot how to play.
Are you sure you are referring to the 40 Licks Tour? Perhaps you had a tad too many martinis. Woody is ON FIRE on this tour!! Best he's played in years. I was third row in front of him in Vegas in Feb. and Lauderdale in Oct. and he was incredible!! Especially CYHMK!!
LadyJ. |
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| tDice pimp |
So ronnie is totally clean now?? because what I've heard is that in BTB tour he was wasted all the time and that's why he didn't play with his full capacity, at least that's the most credible reason I can come up with. And what about Keith?? Is it true that sometimes he revisits smack just for kicks?? |
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| J.J.Flash |
quote:
LadyJane wrote:
Especially CYHMK!!
LadyJ.
Yeah, especially in CYHMK especially on the MSG HBO concert. He was killer!! Really great dear Lady! |
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| T&A |
Folks:
Ronnie is sober now and is trying to reinvent his chops; his chemical addiction destroyed his playing abilities, which was most noticeable starting in the SW tour. However, let's be totally clear hear - when RW plays his best these days, like on a good night with CYHMK, he is playing with nowhere near the prowess of his 75-82 heyday. Not even close. You may like what you hear, but the chops are long gone and are now replaced with someone who is learning to play again, but who has lost (physically) the ability to play what he could years ago. It happens to some, not others. The worst example I've ever heard was the Animals' Hilton Valentine - his chemical dependency cost him nearly the ability to even play the most simple figures....so much so that when the 1983 reunion tour came around, they just propped him up on stage and he pretty much was a statue, getting only one simple solo on Bring it On Home, which I could have played better. And, this guy was a monster on guitar a mere 15 years earlier.
The point is that the drugs/alcohol killed Ronnie's abilities....I admire that he has worked hard in his sobriety to try to reinvent...but it's not the same. Not even close. |
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| full moon |
Over analyzation is great.... |
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| TheSavageYoungXyzzy |
quote:
tDice pimp wrote:
So ronnie is totally clean now?? because what I've heard is that in BTB tour he was wasted all the time and that's why he didn't play with his full capacity, at least that's the most credible reason I can come up with.
Yep. That's it. It was pretty bad, according to his wife - he'd come home and just roll around on the floor, yelling incoherantly. And at the end of every tour they'd try to clean him up and he'd go right back out and start it again. Finally this time something stuck (probably the fact that Mick told him if he didn't do it, he was out), and now he's playin' great.
I'd actually disagree with you, T&A. No, he's not at the '75 level... but neither is Keith, neither is Charlie. The only one still at that level is Mick. Actually, now that Mick's actually singing and not just trying to spit the words out, I think he's doing better. Ronnie's had some absolutely astounding solos (so has Keith on the second leg) that rival '75. I just want them both turned the fuck up so we can hear 'em.
quote:
And what about Keith?? Is it true that sometimes he revisits smack just for kicks??
I dunno. He says yes. I'd say more, but I've gotta run.
-tSYX --- Run run Rudolph, Santa's gotta make it to town... |
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| Joey |
" No he's not kicking keith in the ass every night. it's more like two people riding a bike at the same time, ones peddling while the other's coasting. NOT on every song though, no way. but there's still some questionable shit. "
You make Joey say , Huh ??????
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| gotdablouse |
This is a much discussed topic here, but probably one of the first time in a "argumented manner" ;-) The last I got involved was when Tsyyxxxyxys told us "guitar god was born" after the Roseland (?) show ;-)
Anyway, yes Ron is playing better than ever since I wen to my first concert in 1990, no question about that. 89/90 was still decent, but 94/95 and 97/99 were the nadir of his production. Clearly it ain't no '75 though. Even on Love You Live, you can hear him play some incredible stuff, and it sounds so "natural". These days, as someone pointed out, he's trying really hard to play well again, and while CYHMK is generally a good showcase, it does sound a bit "manufactured", like he's trying a bit too hard. I saw Mick Taylor play in in 1992 at the Mean Fiddler in London and even though the guy was boozed up, it sounded "natural".
Still it's great to see him "with us again".
Talking about disappointments, I'm surprised that Keith just can't quite nail the rythm in the jam part of CYHMK. In Oakland it was major train wreck, but on the HBO show, it's just slightly off when it really has to be spot on to work.
I think the major problem on this tour is Chuck "F#$&*#^" Leavell's honky tonk piano creeping out of everywhere, even on the "punk" tunes like "When the Whip". How can someone as professional as Mick let that happen. That Chuck guy is a disgrace to Rock'n'Roll! There was a time too when Keith had less patience for parasites like this...like with Elton in 1975. I guess they're grateful to him that he helps them remember the tunes, but still...
T |
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| justforyou |
Everyone has their ups and downs, but that drink and drugs should have killed Ronnie's abilities is nonsense. Checkout the Double Door gig, he's playing his part allright. Not to mention the earlier Stripped stuff.
Of course he wasn't really present on the official B2B DVD (hmmm...there was some wah-wah solo in there somewhere), but was that because of intoxication or the sound production itself - away from a guitar dominated one and towards a more predictable and coordinated 'big band' performance ? Yeah, probably both....
Anyway I'm so glad that he's more active in the sound picture now. |
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| Diedre |
How can you even tell how Ron plays? The band has the crappiest sound system, for all the millions they spend building and transporting it. It all sounds muddy, especially when the horns get involved. They have way too many players (and singers) for the type of music they do.
That aside, don't harsh on Ron Wood. Since when has he been an accomplished guitar player? Ever hear the Faces? Totally sloppy -- that was the band's trademark. And reflective of their abilities and playing styles. It kind of does complement what Keith does. And as for Keith being out of time, don't forget, he's not a trained musician. He kind of made stuff up, and people follow what he did, not the other way around. He's not out of rhythm, he's just, er, heavily syncopated. Yeah, that's the ticket. And as for "CYHetc.," maybe he just was never up on Santana. 'Cause that's what the song is/was, a Stones' Santana song. Must have been a favorite group of Mick Taylor's. |
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| sandrew |
If he were asleep, at least that woulda been a good excuse. The sad thing is, he was awake during all that. Even though he's sober now, I think his playing on this tour has scarcely improved -- despite how we're all trying to convince ourselves that he has.
He hasn't, and Keith's playing worse than he ever has before. But who cares? Mick's still at the top of his game, and Charlie's always good tonight. Somehow, the band still manages to work.
It's an amazing phenomenon: No matter how sloppy they sound, it's still the Stones, and it's still great.
[Edited by sandrew] |
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| Joey |
Keith covered his A## from ' 97 - ' 01 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
JJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJ - A - C - K - Y !
Jacky ! |
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| sandrew |
Now Keith needs someone to cover him, but there's no one left. Maybe Blondie should expand his guitar-playing role. All right, I'm kidding, obviously.
[Edited by sandrew] |
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| FAH3 |
I remember Ronnie in Columbus on BTB jumping off the stage riser where the horns where during Miss You. Mick commented on his "death defying leap". Same show Ronnie completely missed the solo during YCAGWYW.
I feel his playing has improved, but there is still the incosistency to his playing. |
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| macawber |
when keith falls down in front of 20,000 people- it's ok,he's "just being keith"
when keith stands there posing and smoking a cigarette-its the horn sections fault for being so loud that we can't hear his brilliant playing
when tickets are overpriced-micks fault.you know jagger forces him to sign the contracts and keep all that cash.
when the stones can't come up with another great rocker-jagger again.it must be mick who's forcing "the riff master"to sing all those ballads.
if none of this works for you,do what everyone else does-blame ronnie |
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| Diedre |
Yeah! Blame Keith!
I do agree about all those damned ballads, though. Keith has turned into Willie Nelson. That's what all those slow, draggy, contemplative songs of his of recent years remind me of. Willie, only without the hooks. What happened to the guy that wrote "Gimme Shelter" all by himself? (Well, probably the same thing that happened to the guy that wrote "Brown Sugar" all by himself.) |
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| TheSavageYoungXyzzy |
Macawaber, I wouldn't go *that* far. Yes, Ronnie does take the fall for a lot of Keith's errors these days.
And yeah, the first leg of the tour, the reason why there was so much yelling onstage was because Ronnie for the first time was covering Keith's ass. He started getting longer and longer applauses every night, he found himself able to joke around while still playing incredibly well (except on the B-stage... goddamn it, man, *ignore* the things people throw at you! Do *not* pick them up mid-song or decide "it's pick-throwing time"!), so when he started jockeying for position or at least recognition with Keith he was met full-force with the "I covered your sorry ass for twenty years without so much as a thank you and now you want to tell me how to play?" excuse. That's why they had a few uneven nights (The Joint being the biggest example).
The second leg, Keith realized just how much he needed to get back in shape, but right now I think the tandem bicycle explanation is the one that works the best. We talk a lot about songs like "Sympathy" and "Gimme Shelter" being 'Keith's songs' while "All Down The Line", "Don't Stop" and "If You Can't Rock Me" are 'Ronnie's songs' - there's a lack of 'weave numbers'.
Keith is getting his act together, just like Ronnie. But I'm willing to cut Keith a lot more slack if only because he did indeed carry Ronnie through '82 and a whole lotta '89, and '94.
On the other hand, the reason why I think they hit a live slump in '89, '94 and '97 was because for a great deal of nights *no one* was playing the goddamn guitar. You can't blame one person for this... you want to blame someone, you've gotta blame both Keith and Ronnie. It was their absence that brought in the goddamn backing chorus, the wall of sidemen, and Cock Leavell.
-tSYX --- Some girls I give all my breath to, I don't ever want 'em back... |
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| marko |
Hmhmh keef didn�t carry ronnie in 1982 or 1989,,,more likely
1997-1999. |
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| Moonisup |
"was ronnie awake"
most of the time his eyes where open
so, yes ! |
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| Joey |
"was ronnie awake"
most of the time his eyes where open
so, yes ! "
MoonisUp ..............You are absolutely Precious ----You MAY Touch My Monkey this evening !
JACKY !
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