|
|
| Noonan McKane |
Around 1992, I was at a record fair in Ayr (West Scotland) when I came across a beautifully presented 2 disc vinyl LP called "Philadelphia Special II" on the Swingin' Pig label.
Aesthetically this thing was peerless; Glossy gatefold sleeve with pin-sharp photo-art, paper/plastic inner sleeves, swirly, multi-coloured vinyl discs, the lot.
The recorded music, however, did leave something to be desired. As many of you will no doubt know, this record consists mainly of 'from-the-rows' recordings of the the 1972 tour from Philly, Texas and (I think) MSG at the wrong speed and with the band some way away from full 'tightness'.
Twenty quid the robbing bastard had off me.
Still, no matter, I cherish it yet.
To my point. Since then, what with the CD-R age and all, I've procured some fantastic boots, although it has to be said that the best ones contain not live shows but studio out-takes, alternate takes etc, my favourite being a CD calling itself 'The 1970 sessions' (although the content thereon dates between Feb. 68 and 1973) which includes a version of 'Two Trains'(Still A Fool) which I can scarcely believe was never mixed to a finish and released on a legit record. I also grabbed a lovely CD with 'B T Buttons/Aftermath out-takes which had "I Can See It" which is a wee bit fantastic.
What's your favourite bootleg? |
|
|
| polksalad69 |
What makes a good bootleg?
quote:
Noonan McKane wrote:
Glossy gatefold sleeve with pin-sharp photo-art
drop the G
open G? |
|
|
| mac_daddy |
>>> What makes a good bootleg?
two most important factors are sound and performance qualities...
the best boots have the best of both of these worlds...
then you get into things that are more subjective in nature - AUD vs. SBD, complete vs. piecemeal sources, the importance of lineage, etc.
a good bootleg is one that you enjoy.
[Edited by mac_daddy] |
|
|
| Noonan McKane |
Do you prefer concerts or unreleased studio material? |
|
|
| mac_daddy |
quote:
Noonan McKane wrote:
Do you prefer concerts or unreleased studio material?
two different animals.
but I, personally adore, all things Stones! |
|
|
| Phog |
Interesting topic.
My first two boots were on vinyl--Marquee Club '71 and a studio outakes mish-mash called "Diverse Harmonics". I got 'em in '83 when I was 11 or 12 years old. For the longest time I liked the studio boots the best. There was something about unreleased songs that just enthralled me. As I've gotten older, however, I tend to gravitate towards the live performance boots. Neither is better than the other. It's more of a personal preference issue.
What makes a good bootleg?? Good question, but again it comes down to personal preferences. Performance and sound quality certainly matter. If, for whatever reason, a certain boot has a personal meaning to someone,then that counts just as much. Personal meanings like: you were at the show, it's got all your favorite songs, etc...
If I like it and listen to it more than once, then it's a good boot. |
|
|
| fmk438j |
As far as packaging and art goes, this means zero imo.
Music is music, packaging... is packaging. If Brussles came in a brown sleeve with a picture of a turd on the front I'd still love that boot. How it's presented is a trivial point in the whole matter.
I don't pay the ridiculous prices the boot companies demand, and I find it amusing that some people justify paying these 'becuase you get great artwork'. What a load of crap.
|
|
|
| F505 |
What makes a good bootleg?
The ones where the rawness of the Stones is captured and not their technical skill. Thus for me, Cow skins and pig shoes, shepherds bush, London 1999. is one of my favorites. Outstanding setlist and the guitars loud and mean in a steaming ambiance. |
|
|
| Moonisup |
My first boots where, all 3 at once, Texas 1989, Stripped companion, and Voodoo Brew, I bought them when I was um 16 I think, and well, the titles speak for themselves. |
|
|
| steel driving hammer |
The listener. |
|
|
| jb |
Mick Taylor has long been ignored and under appreciated by todays so-called Rolling Stones fans....they are either too young, too ignorant, or afraid to admit that the Taylor era was unequivocally the greatest period of any rock band in history..This man , through his incredible guitar playing, allowed the Stones to create the finest music ever recorded ....the concerts at this time were nothing short of "the second coming of the Lord" as the Stones mesmerized their audiences unlike no other band.... |
|
|
| steel driving hammer |
quote:
jb wrote:
the Taylor era was unequivocally the greatest period of any rock band in history..
Yes but can't forget Brian studio JJF etc and the ying and the yang.
But I think it stems from people like Charlie... |
|
|
| Sir Stonesalot |
Knock it off JB. I know this discussion means nothing to you, but I am asking that you and Joey PLEASE let this thread alone. Just let people discuss this topic...THIS topic...not Mick Taylor.
If you have something to contribute on the subject of "what makes a great bootleg", please do so. I KNOW you have some good ones,,,because I sent them to you. Try putting up a post that is actually on topic for once...I think you can do it.
Now back to the topic, for me sound quality is not nearly as important as performance. I mean, it's a bootleg. Bootlegs have less than perfect sound. Good sound quality is a nice bonus, but for me all I care about when it comes to sound quality is that you can actually listen to it. As long as I can hear all the parts, that's really all I care about. Now, what is listenable is, of course, a matter of personal preferance. I guess I must have a rather generous ear, because things that I consider listenable, others have said are crap.
I have had several trades with anal retentive types who try to send back what I called a "listenable audience recording". One quote was...it sounds like it was recorded from the bathroom. I said, yeah, but listen to the MUSIC...the music is really good. I no longer trade with that person. Oh, I replaced his discs with another choice...but I'm not gonna trade with someone who is so obsessed with sound quality...IT'S A BOOTLEG!!! For me, as long as the sound isn't garbled, or talked over...as long as I can actually listen to the music...it's good enough for me.
I care nothing at all about the packaging. All I need is a setlist...and if that can't be provided...the proper date and location, or boot title, so I can find the setlist online. Lately I haven't even bothered much about artwork. I just don't have time to sit down and make nice art for everything I get. If the art is easily downloaded, I'll print it...but otherwise I just make out a plain white back with the setlist on it, and a plain white cover with the artist, date, and venue.
For me the most important things about a bootleg are the performance, and the setlist. Is the band hot, and is the setlist nice...if those questions can both be answered with a yes, then I'll be happy.
My fave Stones bootleg is Handsome Girls. It is just so mean and nasty. Yeah, I know, the sound quality is great...but even if it didn't sound so great, this would still be my fave. The band is so....PUNK! You put on that boot and man, you can just SMELL the cocaine! It's so fast and raw and full of attitude. It almost makes you feel like YOU just did some lines! That feeling comes straight from the band, not the sound quality. I have bootlegs that have better sound quality, but they don't make me feel as good as Handsome Girls does.
Another fave of mine is Opening Night in DC 94. This is a audience recording...and I was in the audience that night. The setlist is great, the band was ragged but playing with vim & vigor...just how I like 'em best. And I get the added bonus of the memories from being at the show. Again, I have better quality shows, but they don't make me feel as good as this one.
|
|
|
| jb |
I thought the MT post was sincere and somewhat on topic....As far as boots, to me, the quality is of first and foremost importance. It must be a soundboard recording to even be considered worth listening to. Next, is obviously the time period..for me, nothing compares to the boots from 69-73 era. |
|
|
| Sir Stonesalot |
Yay for JB!
An on topic post! And one that even made sense!
Congratulations. You only have 9,999 more QUALITY posts to go to reach 10,000.
I know ya got it in ya! |
|
|
| jb |
quote:
Sir Stonesalot wrote:
Yay for JB!
An on topic post! And one that even made sense!
Congratulations. You only have 9,999 more QUALITY posts to go to reach 10,000.
I know ya got it in ya!
Not to go off topic, but I wanted to ask you if Nick Berg lived near you? |
|
|
| Mikey |
I've been following today's postings throughout and its funny to see JB "bully" other posters and hijack threads, yet cower like a kitten when SS or Gazza step on the playground. ("Can I buy you a steak SS?" or "Gazza, that's not fair").
Now I guess I'll get an earful about my limited number of posts in comparison. |
|
|
| Sir Stonesalot |
No. Nick berg lived nowhere near me.
What does that have to do with bootlegs?
|
|
|
| jb |
quote:
Mikey wrote:
I've been following today's postings throughout and its funny to see JB "bully" other posters and hijack threads, yet cower like a kitten when SS or Gazza step on the playground. ("Can I buy you a steak SS?" or "Gazza, that's not fair").
Now I guess I'll get an earful about my limited number of posts in comparison.
Considering Gazza ia an administrator and i don't want to be banned, I do conform to his requests..As far as SS, long before you came here, SS and I had a friendly r/s and he even sent me my first boots...I don't like to start a war with old timers here so yes, I often avoid getting into it with a old time regular like SS....Currdently, neither he nor I are on friendly terms...however, I would still buy him a steak dinner as he did help me with the boots initially...
By the way, why do you go out of your way to talk shit about me-who the hell appointed you as the board police?
[Edited by jb] |
|
|
| Bloozehound |
SS is a very serious man
serious indeed sir |
|
|
| jb |
quote:
Bloozehound wrote:
SS is a very serious man
serious i
ndeed sir
I can appreciate a guy like you Bloozehound..very witty and totally "get it"...You are a fresh and welcomed addition to the board.
|
|
|
| Bloozehound |
thanks for the kind words jb
I like your style too
I've been having a great time posting with the elite of online Stones fans here at Rocks Off
|
|
|
| Bloozehound |
quote:
Mikey wrote:
I've been following today's postings throughout and its funny to see JB "bully" other posters and hijack threads, yet cower like a kitten when SS or Gazza step on the playground. ("Can I buy you a steak SS?" or "Gazza, that's not fair").
Now I guess I'll get an earful about my limited number of posts in comparison.
speaking of steaks
SS when you gonna hook us up with your herb steak marinade recipe ? |
|
|
| Sir Stonesalot |
I'll give you my marinade recipe when I die.
Congratulations you just made my will.
Now, what does any of this have to do with bootlegs? |
|
|
| Bloozehound |
it must be a seriously guarded family secret
i listened to handsome girls disk 3 last night
it rocked |
|
|
| Sir Stonesalot |
Nope...it's all of my own creation.
Besides it's a matter of taste. You may think I put too much garlic, or too many herbs.
Be creative. Make your own. |
|
|
| Bloozehound |
I'm actually pretty good griller and am always looking for new marinades and rubs
bootlegs should be traded freely by and for fans
buying and selling them is BS |
|
|
| Lazy Bones |
Imo, both quality and performance are of equal advantages. Being recorded DAO (disc-at-once) is also key when grading a boot, imo.
Artwork is nice, but artist, date and venue are the minimal identity pieces I prefer when labelling (if artwork isn't available). The majority of my shows/boots are now housed in paper sleeves with show info printed on a file folder label shelved in chronilogical order by artist.
|
|
|
| throbby |
What a great thread.
For me it's a raunchy and in your face guitar sound like the Brussels show or the '78 shows. For me to play a boot loud through my sound system it must have good sound quality, not perfect but good. IMHO quite a few boots can only be listened to at low volume, played loud they turn into a distorted mess. Headphones are much more forgiving when listening to certain boots.
I agree with SS, there are some real gems out there poorly recorded but loaded with intense ass shaking energy. The first time I heard the '73 Honolulu version of "It's All Over Now" I was quite knocked out. What a great fucking groove the boys had going on during that tune. Many glimpses of inspiration in some of those badly recorded boots.
|
|
|
| Phog |
I can understand that everyone would probably prefer a soundboard if given the choice. However, I shudder to think of all the great boots I wouldn't have if I limited my choices to soundboards only. Throbby mentioned Honolulu '73. How about these great audience recordings:
Vienna '73, Oakland '69 (Live'r), San Diego '69, Paradiso '95, Frisco '75, Oakland '99, Shepherd's Bush '99, Oakland '02, Charlotte '72, Astoria '03, Stockholm Cirkus '03, Wembley '99, MSG '98, London '73, and on and on.....
|
|
CHAT
ROOM aka THE FUN HOUSE] [
RESTROOMS]