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| CS |
Friday, 14 February, 2003, 17:29 GMT
Bianca Jagger: Champion of peace
Bob Chaundy
BBC News Profiles Unit
Bianca Jagger is taking a prominent role in opposing the planned war against Iraq. For years, she has campaigned for a more humanitarian approach to world problems.
"How many times has the United States been successful in exporting democracy to other countries?"
Bianca Jagger poses this rhetorical question in answer to the argument that America will create a climate in which freedoms can flourish once it has liberated Iraq from Saddam Hussein.
Her scepticism is based on her own experiences in Central America. She regards a visit she made to Honduras in 1981 as one of the formative episodes of her life.
She was part of a delegation which witnessed a death squad, from the US-backed military, marching away a group of refugees. Despite having guns trained at them, Jagger and others trailed the soldiers with cameras until they released their captives.
Taking the Mick in 1971
From then on, she decided to devote her career to the cause of human rights.
It was not an easy transformation. Here was the so-called Queen of the Night who had famously ridden naked on a white stallion into New York's legendary Studio 54 nightclub.
She was the beauty who had captured the heart of rock's ultimate lothario - having the gall to wear a plunging neckline and see-through blouse when she married Rolling Stone Mick Jagger in 1971 in St Tropez.
Now, she was becoming something of a moral priestess - rock chick to compassion chic, or so it seemed.
Such impressions have long since disappeared. For, over the past two decades, Bianca Jagger has compiled an impressive curriculum vitae of humanitarian causes.
Campaigning for justice
She has fought for the rights of indigenous groups in Brazil, held talks with warring factions in Northern Ireland and campaigned for the victims of Aids.
She has served as a goodwill ambassador for the Albert Schweizer Institute that helps the sick in the developing world, and worked for Amnesty International in their campaigns against torture and the death penalty.
On one trip to war-torn Bosnia, in 1993, she rescued a boy who doctors said would die unless he could be flown abroad for treatment.
After endless appeals to friends in high places, she persuaded the commander of a British tank battalion to escort her on a harrowing two-day trip through a mountain road to Split.
Addressing a UN coference on violence against women in 1999
The boy was saved and she remains friends with him and his family.
In many parts of the world, Bianca Jagger has campaigned for the victims of violence against women. She was born in Nicaragua, in 1950, into a society that valued only men.
Her family was reasonably well off. But her parents divorced when she was 10.
Her mother - who had never worked - was forced to open a roadhouse canteen to afford her daughter's convent education.
"My mother was turned into something less than a person by that very repressive Catholic society. I decided that, under no circumstances, was I going to be a second-class citizen because I was a woman."
At the age of 16, she won a scholarship to the Paris Institute of Political Studies. It was in the French capital that she met, and fell immediately in love with, Mick Jagger, then a tax exile.
A rolling stone...
At first, the hedonistic lifestyle was appealing. But later, the endless circus of celebrity life failed to satisfy the stability she craved.
"I no longer was a person in my own right who had my own thoughts, my own beliefs, my own working life."
The couple divorced after eight years. Thanks to a pre-nuptial agreement, Mick saw to it that Bianca received a meagre half-million pound settlement. Today, she lives on an investment income and the fruits of a lucrative lecture tour circuit.
She looks back with little fondness to those married days, though they produced her daughter Jade whom she sees often, along with her two grandchildren.
And, despite huge offers, she has refused to kiss and tell.
Yet, her star quality and designer elegance ensure the occasional re-appearance in the gossip columns.
Networking in the corridors of power in Washington, and attending countless fundraising dos, has brought her into contact with influential people.
She has had well-publicised relationships with two US Democratic senators, Christopher Dodd and Robert Torricelli.
Bianca Jagger has been characterised as well-informed, forthright, difficult, driven, all the adjectives one might expect from a humanitarian campaigner.
Her appearance on the current anti-war platform is consistent with her belief that, in her words, "Individuals can make a difference. I feel that one of the failings of our society today is that people have begun to lose the belief that you can influence the decision-makers".
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| glencar |
She should kiss & tell. Take the money & run, as it were. She's still a stunning woman but her ideas are unappealing. Perhaps she should visit Kim Jong Il & make peace with him. |
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| moy |
Human rights campaigner Bianca Jagger surveys the crowd during a rally against a war with Iraq, in London's Hyde Park, Saturday, Feb. 15, 2003. (AP Photo/Richard Lewis) |
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| luxury1 |
"Well take a look at your face now baby. Look at you and look at me...." |
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| Nellcote |
Apologies to Mick if he's reading the board.
NOTHING is more loathing than Bianca Jagger.
What a complete cling on.
Typical faux Hollywood elitist harping about something she hasn't got a clue about. Exile Saddam to Nicaragua so he can gas, rape, pillage her relatives, like he did to the Kurds, to shut her up. I hope she and Jesse Jackson take a plne to Baghdad and are used as human sheilds!
Looks like I will not get any backstage invites now! |
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| nankerphelge |
Wow did luxy hit the nail on the head. I thought of the exact same lyric when I saw her. |
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| Bluzian |
Nellcote:
So then you support VIOLENCE towards WOMEN!??? Hmmm.. As a
true fan of rocknroll music, and no fan of celebrity, I find
bianca Jagger's international work not only refreshing, but
worthwhile. If anything, Mick fuckin' Jagger should take a
few lessons' from his first ex-wife, and do something useful
with himself, rather than prance arund on stage like a fuckin
monkey! Like.. If you put bianca and mick in the same room
together, he seems completely RIGHT OUT TO LUNCH!!!!!! where
as she has got her shit together!! Mick is cool and all,
but, only in a certain "context". The context isn't real.
it's fabricated. A rock star is not real by any stretch of
the imagination. It's a silly glamourous phoney lifestyle.
Cheers,
Ian
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| throbby |
OUCH!!
I don't know if Mick will be able to finish the tour after reading this last post. Finally he from on high has spoken. |
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| glencar |
What a silly post, Ian. It sounds like you'll stay home when the Stones go to your area. As for Bianca, I think her heart's in the right place but her head's up her ass. Perhaps she'll go home to Nicaraugua & test her popularity in her homeland. |
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| Martha |
CS thanks so much for posting this information about Bianca. I wasn't aware of how she's been directing her life and it is inspiring to learn of her campaigning for peace efforts. She is a special person to be speaking out against human suffering. How that can be trashed and disregarded is way beyond me. May she be blessed for her self-less efforts. |
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| icydanger |
yes,
bravo Bianca,
go on
read this in australian news:
The fresh outpouring of anti-war sentiment may not be enough to dissuade Bush or his advisers from their resolute preparations for war. But the sheer number of protesters offers a potent message that any rush to war may have political consequences for nations that support Bush's march into the Tigris and Euphrates valleyseat.
!!!!
Darius
not like this dude into
wanting to try his daddy's toy's,
After manoeuvring flocks of steeled vehicles weapons and puppets around, general bush built in Baghdad a Texas grand casino and cinema, a KFC Burger King flish flesh flash -lighting, a huge shopping centre, golf courses in his dreams before moving on further.
�I have a dream ever since daddy�� (daddy�s glue oh yeah)
how can one say "game over?" we talking lives here
18 million iraqis depending on humanitarian ressources, nowadays and since years,
bad managing?
no..., the after effects of the embargo. (sure the regime didnt help much, red)
i say no more blood
and it would be a tragedy there, and the snow ball effect
blue glue? true
clue
blue blue
stone
la peace lazouli
lapis lazuli (you know the stone from afghanistan)
i think india's outlook on this matter, as much as china, africa, and australia and south america (?)should be predominant.(or do their weapon inventory not allow them to be a good opponant?) sorry
any way, i worry about the states loosing energy, and fear lack of attention/$$$ on the population, the social system, the education and so on. Restricitons. this story touches me to the deepest like it does most of you.
balances
i mean covering half the planet with a like bubble against radations is,,,,
lets hope we never get to this point.
be global
lol
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| JaggaRichards |
Bianca's a tired old twat. She'd show up at the opening of an envelope if it would get her publicity.
BTW, zap Saddam--quick! |
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| Fiji Joe |
Perhaps Bianca's children can preach to my children in the future as they are cowering in their basement whilst every penny-anty dictator has a nuke...their will be no need to preach to my grandchildren...they certainly will be mental mutant defectives...what with all the radiation and all...I don't think the slobbering bastards will understand anything anyone is saying to them...
What's that you say peace protester?...we can trust despotic tyrants to do the right and humane thing?...Well then, disregard this post
And icy, your solution to your fear of nuclear proliferation is to turn the other way when people like Saddam and Jong state their intention to accumulate such items?...I have to say that is a somewhat odd and selfish decision...you know, in a kind of pass the buck way...
How old are you? Do you have any recollection of the painstaking measures the US and the former Soviet Union went through to acheive a reduction in their respective nuclear arms?...
Dude or Dudette, If you can honestly tell me that you don't have any worries about Hussein and Jong having such things then I guess there really is no debating with you...You strike me as as person who just appreciates a good protest...no matter what the cause...
Here's a mental exercise for you...why don't you post on here those situations in which you think war is appropriate..then, I think myself and others will have a better idea of where you are coming from...
[Edited by Fiji Joe] |
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| Nellcote |
C'mon let's get real.
Bianca for peace? Why was she not there in '91 when Saddam gassed, raped, murdered his own people?
Saddam Hussein=Adolf Hitler, plain and simple.
Everyone wants peace, however, just because Bianca decides it's suddenly chic to go to Baghdad now? Why was she not asking Saddam about the 16 times he has refused to abide by the UN sanctions? Throwing out arms inspectors left and right, concealing serin, ricin, other nerve gases when he should have been complying with UN sanctions to turn them over. Look, this whole mess is Saddam's to explain. Do not be fooled by the Hollywood elitists who claim to be peace loving individuals. These same losers who have drank champagne, ate caviar all this time suddenly forget where they live? Look at Ed Harris, Sean Penn, Susan Sarandon Barbara Streisand, Jessica Lange, all ditching the US to support peace. Sean Penn even went to Baghdad, for what? Did he ask Saddam where the wepons were? Did he ask him to comply with the UN agreements The Iraquis said they would comply with 12 years ago? No, he went there saying the US was wrong. What a jerk! During WWII, Hollywood actors would enlist in the Army, now they ridicule our government. These people ought to be ashamed of themselves.
Anyone out there lose anyone close to them during 9/11?
Are you really going to support people such as Bianca who condone Saddam's activity,thus opening the door for another 9/11 type tragedy? These loser dictators need to be picked off, one by one. Yes, by saying Bianca is good for peace, you give Saddam more time to hide weapons, deceit the world, gas,rape and murder his own people, his own family. Read the real stories about the Great Saddam Hussein people, before you believe some chick from Central America, who was nothing before she met Jagger, and daily proves she still is nothing now.
Either Saddam coughs up the aresenal he is holding, agrees to live in exile, or face the music.
Sure, I realize I face crap on this board by talking political, however, I busts my butt to see these dispicable human beings such as The Princess of Empty, Bianca Jagger open her mouth, and people actually think she is doing good. At this point, I do not care. Bianca Jagger does not care about about America. Folks, she is a budan, do anything for an Andy Warhol moment, 15 minutes of fame. Show me the way (whoops-a Frampton moment) that Saddam be dealt with any other way. Further, show me the way any other dictator in history has agreed to go hand over any power related instrument of operating his country. He cannot, he will not. As long as he is allowed to operate, every single one of us lives in jeapordy. |
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| Fiji Joe |
Nellcote...you are the wind beneath my wings |
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| Fiji Joe |
Martha wrote"
"She is a special person to be speaking out against human suffering. How that can be trashed and disregarded is way beyond me."
With all due respect Martha, it can be trashed very easily...i've said this before...but let's look at the human suffering that has been wrought in the past century...Almost without exception, it was allowed and caused by pacifism in the face of danger...check it out...I ain't lying...
20 million Russian citizens dead at the hands of Stalin
6 million Jews dead at the hands of Hitler
3 million Chinese dead and raped by the Japanese -- more than that
etc.
etc.
etc.
etc.
And that's not even couting the millions of lives lost trying to correct the mistakes of pacifism...
I would agree, there are such things as unjustified wars...this ain't one of em'
I think it is a very dangerous proposition preaching peace for peace's sake...I think this debate is purely a matter of recognizing a danger when it exists...Obviously, there are many out there who do not see a problem with a proven murderer remaining in power and being allowed to pursue his hobby at the expense of his own people and de-stabilizing the world's energy supply...That's cool...If you don't have a problem with leaving this mess for your children and grandchildren to clean up...Just don't be surprised if one Christmas they quit coming around |
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| glencar |
Good points, Nellcote & Fiji. Don't let's forget the pacifism of the Vietnam era led to 3 million Cambodians getting killed. Some wore glasses which caused the regime to think they were a danger. We should all work for peace but we should all be somewhat realistic. I think Bianca does some good work but jumping on a bandwagon isn't raelly that much work, is it? For a woman with real guts, take a look at Oriana Fallaci. This is a daangerous world right now & someone has to make things right. |
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| icydanger |
�Pacifism in the face of danger� : -Causes, evaluations of the danger?
Wasnt the aim terrorism? saddam is a tyrant, not a terrorist.
Why send 200 000 soldiers and + over there, after having brainwashed population (fox, cnn) as if war were a fatality? Is the army that huge it can disperse lives/energy all over?
Wouldn�t if of been enough to send discreetly a commando over saddam�s regime and control strictly his activities?
I am far more worried about the weapons and methods that fanatic religious movements accumulate and develop in times of frustration then about the defective skuds and wacky chemicals. (fee jee I know thats on your mind an awful lot, even though he is a tyrant, his target is limited to his own people and the Kurds, i cant picture him invading Koweit or Iran as he then did)
Imao stopping saddam will not stop terrorism.
With repression terrorism will grow, and this on our own grounds, with our own means.
We all know terrorism migrates, and has stases all over.
The cause matters.
When is war appropriate?
When there is an invasion/violation of property. (why is the dalai lama still not in Tibet?)
Controlling Saddam seems a good solution.
Invading, well?
I am worried about the terrorist threat .(not just in Iraq, everywhere) I am worried that we may lose control of the situation. Too many sorts of food are on the fire.
Russia China, WWII,...? at the time, the violations could be located easily, therefore controlled.
Interventions were needed, no doubt about that.
Imao terrorism is not comparable to any of the situations we have been faced with before, the threat is new and I feel focusing on irak is a mistake.
Terrorism is sprayed all over, I am not a specialist but I think we should not mix things up.
Tell me how could Sean Penn go to a place, the border line of Kurdistan, (if was looking for chemical weapons) where saddam himself is afraid to go?
(and once you get there, if you get there, integrists may be gone).
About Bianca: how can you, Fee Jee judge who is nothing? What are the criterias for �being nothing�?
Did you study her C.V.? (I wonder if Mick thinks she is nothing btw)
�You are against war, so you are nothing�. Let me pull the trigger then so I can be something, more then an a/s/l
What about the families from the people deceased in the WTC who manifested for peace?
I was very touched that they were able to get over their sad feelings.
Which dictator would invade a neighbour land, knowing the States and Nato can squash their own country completely and reduce them to nothing?
Terrorism is invisible, dosnt invade countries; it lives/spies within, attacks anywhere, has no real centre and rots deep in the heart of the repressed, then comes out as a revenge.
Yes, the cause matters: integrism. The cause of 9/11 was not Saddam.
The cause is: organisations who train people for suicide missions, who build up the hatred, or who take advantage of the weakness and feeling of inequity in the masses to recruit. (like sects)
Did you ever wonder why dedicated nurses become suddenly living bombs?
-Find those many training sites and send commando�s there.
a nice day to all of you, beautiful people
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| Fiji Joe |
icy...let me put this in a way you can understand:
rocker off of you. might see trees, but forest in way.
Bianca Jagger qualifications amount to poo diddly. Have myself fought for peace which more is then yapping about. try you see big picture please.
Man, that hurt.
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| Monkey Woman |
I commend your courage, icydanger. Thanks for people like you and Martha or Moonisup, this board is not totally one-sided in its world view.
I'm afraid there's lots of confusion, here and in the rest of the world these days. Confusing terrorism with dictatorship for one. Or an immediate danger with a long-term one.
But the worst maybe is the rift this is creating among people who are basically on the same side, wich is democracy and human rights, but live in different countries. The insults hurled here and there make it difficult not to jump in the thick of it and hit the next available target.
Now, you would think the USA are currently under attack and that European countries are aiding terrorists! Or that people who don't support all-out war are traitors, cowards, anti-American, etc. Take you pick...
As if there was no middle road between the status quo in Iraq and total invasion of that country. Which would bring in backlash more hate towards America among Arab countries, more recruits for terrorism, then of course more war.
The international community is containing Saddam Hussein now, making it nearly impossible for him to make more ABC weapons. That effort should be sustained and not abandonned! Keeping troops in the Gulf while going on with the inspections is a valid way to make pressure on Iraq and threaten that country with the possibility of sudden strikes (like in 1998 for instance) if they don't comply.
But a complete, terrestrial invasion, going all the way to Baghdad would not only cost a huge lot of human lives (American and Arab both).
It would also be a royal gift to the terrorist organization Al-Qaida and all like-minded extremists! They are the worst danger because they thrive on division among their ennemies. They would give their lives to bring on a civilizational war between Islam and the Occident. Some of them already did, on September 11th 2001.
Other terrorist tried the same strategy in other countries, at other times. Europe has suffered in the past all kind of terrorist attacks, in the middle of our capital cities. There was the communist Red Army Fraction in '70s and '80s, kidnapping, assassinating, bombing in France, Germany, Italy. There is the Irish Republican Army for now about 30 years (bombs and assassinations in the UK). The Basque separatists are still active in Spain and France. Islamic terrorists have tried also to spread hate in our countries. In 1995, Paris had to face a wave of bombing in underground trains and other very public places. The police tracked down the terrorists, of course. Most of them have been arrested and put in prison. But there was also a lot of diplomatic activity in the offing between Paris and countries like Algeria, where individual terrorists came from, to help catching the existing criminals and ensure that there wouldn't be more.
Of course the '95 crisis was of a smaller scale than the one initiated by the attack WTC in 2001. But it helps to show that terrorism can be overcome without a war. It's especially crucial now that we are facing a world wide crisis because it could mean a world war too.
So we, in Europe and America and all over the world, should not let fear and anger dictate our actions. We need to keep our heads in these strange, difficult times.
OK, now I've said my piece, I'll keep it at that and go back to the reason we all came here for: the Stones and their music!!!
Mick, Keith, Charlie, Ron, we need you to soothe our feelings and repair our frayed tempers!  :cool    |
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| Fiji Joe |
Insults...I think we are passed the insults...You see insults?... Show me insults...Lively debate, nothing more.
I say this because we were lectured very sternly by the admins regarding insults and rude comments based on someone's ethnicity or national origin, etc...So, let's keep this in perspective...if you do not like these types of threads, why don't you complain to the people who originate these threads?...That's a good place to start
[Edited by Fiji Joe] |
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| JaggaRichards |
Take 'em all out!
One at a time if need be |
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| Nellcote |
It is fact that Saddam has aided terrorists in the past.
Thus, he too is a terrorist.
He needs to allow full and complete access to all of the underground areas he has storage areas in.
He needs to turn over the mobile chemical factories he has.
He needs to allow unfettered access to all his chemists.
Then, he needs to take the jet we will provide him to exile
in a country which will deal with him, not allow him to have contact with the outside world, control him.
Then, we will have neutered one more ruthless terrorist dictator.
After that, move on to all of the others, including the Yoko Ono lookalike who runs North Korea. Make him eat grass like he has let his people for almost a decade.
How anyone could even think to let these type of people stay in control of a country is well beyond my thinking.
[Edited by Nellcote] |
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| sirmoonie |
Its too bad that Keith has decided to pup tent with this Marksist anti-humanist school of thought. Especially since he's been enjoying American-type freedoms for so long. And he claims that he loves New York. Yeah right. Kabul bin Keith loves nothing but his friggin' drugs and trash-mouthing America's interests!
I wonder how the mothers of American soldiers who died fighting Islamicals in Afghanistan feel with Mr. Richard's and his ilkness pissing all over the graves of their children. Thats what I wonder. How do they feel with all this slanderous peace crap flying all over the graves of their loins?!! |
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| Mother baby |
[quote]Bluzian wrote:
If anything, Mick fuckin' Jagger should take a
few lessons' from his first ex-wife, and do something useful
with himself, rather than prance arund on stage like a fuckin monkey!
Useful???? What else could he possibly be doing that's more useful than he's doing right now?
"Mick is cool and all,"
Great line...master of the understatement I see.
"but, only in a certain "context". The context isn't real.
it's fabricated. A rock star is not real by any stretch of
the imagination. It's a silly glamourous phoney lifestyle."
You're probaby right about that in a way. But isn't that exactly what it is SUPPOSED to be? That part of it is show business....Fantasy Land ...but it's a great safety valve too in this day and age....relax.. enter into the Fantasy Land for a while...Reality Land isn't going anywhere.
But the Songs are real...and "useful"...but principally (forget the "rock star" crap for a second) the Stones are Artists and I don't know much of anything more "useful" than that. I guess.
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| Martha |
My comments about Bianca came from my having read the article that CS posted. I stiill commend her for her efforts.
I did not make any statements about the current political situation. I do not plan to.
Please refrain from including in your posts what you believe to be my thinking on the subject (a subject that I did not comment on in the first place). Thank you.
Just because I am peace loving does not mean I am against the US. The assumptions some of you decided about me regarding my original post is incorrect and inflammatory. I will let you know my beliefs if and when I choose and will not be dragged into an argument by these distorted (manipulative) assumptions.
I respect the opinions of everyone that expressed them and asked to be treated in kind.
I wish peace to everyone. |
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| Fiji Joe |
Always amazes me how people voluntarily participate in a political thread and then cry like a baby when their opinion is attacked or otherwise disrespected...
[Edited by Fiji Joe] |
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| somegirl |
Go for it Bianca!!!!!
War is not the answer,
and I would really like to know how the Rolling Stones
think about that! Do you really think they appreciate
Bush�s plans to go to war on Iraq??? |
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| Fiji Joe |
To the extent that a stable middle-east means more disposable income to spend on their records...you can bet your sweet ass that the Stones favor U.S., British and Australian intervention in Iraq...next question |
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| somegirl |
are you really that sure??
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