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| sasca |
If you had read my posts you would know I am not European. |
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| telecaster |
quote:
sasca wrote:
Of course, it can also be argued that appeasement worked in the destruction of the Soviets. History teaches many lessons.
[Edited by sasca]
Gorby himself said it was SDI (Star Wars) that broke Russias back.
He said he knew they could not keep up and threw in the
towel. |
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| sasca |
So not war. |
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| sasca |
It is interesting that someone like me, who simply dislikes war, is so much more objectionable to many of you than a bigot like jb, who calls for genocide. I knew a guy who's father was killed by black men, or so he claimed. Consequently he hated all 'kaffirs.' Is this acceptable to you? If not, then why so little anger with jb? |
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| Riffhard |
Well sasca I don't know where your from and quite frankly I don't care. All your retoric about containment and appeasment has convinced me of one thing. You will never see the need for war. Even though every resolution that Saddam has agreed to he has broken! Every one sasca! Every fucking one!!
Defectors of Iraq have described the ruthlessness of Saddam's regeime. Yet nothing will convince you! Over three thousand dead people,not all of them American,on 9/11/01! The very same people that helped plan that attack are now in Baghdad as confirmed by the Austailian and American intell sources! Even that is not enough evidence for you! No,I think you need to see more dead Americans! What else could possibly convince you?!?!?!?!?!?!
As for your statement about jb. I am not posting on this thread to address jb. I'm disscussing the threat of Iraq. Your statment that you don't like war is laughable! Are you suggesting that those who want Saddam out like war? Ofcourse we don't. We have just woken up to the evilness of this man and the only way to rid the world of him. Unfortunatly that looks like war.
Here's a clue for you sasca the USA is not the bad guy here!! Get it through your incredibly thick head!!
Riffhard
[Edited by Riffhard] |
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| sasca |
When did I say the USA was the bad guy? |
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| Sir Stonesalot |
sascy said:>THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH PACIFISM.<
I agree. After your last post, I'd say it has more to do with stupidity and being incredibly naive.
Saddam may not be allowed to become a "military power". Why? Because he is crazy...in a very evil, bad way.
We've been trying for 12 years to resolve this thing with Saddam. We tried diplomacy. We tried economic sanctions. We tried UN pressure. We tried limited military action. All have failed. It is time to end this farce. It is time to free Iraq from the iron fist of the tyrant. It is time to free the flow of Iraqi oil. Iraqi soldiers do not have to die. Iraqi civilians do not have to die. All they have to do is lay down their weapons and raise their hands in surrender. There will be no mass executions of prisoners from the US and our allies. The refugees will be safe with us.
Saddam WILL be removed from power. Dead or alive. His choice. |
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| sasca |
Why is it so self-evident now when it was not, say, 3 years ago? |
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| Riffhard |
The simple answer to that sasca is this. Three years ago was before 9/11! From that point forward the world changed in a dramatic way. The USA woke up to the fact that certain terrorist organizations and the countries that support and enable them are out to wipe out western civilization.
Al Qeada has stated this. So has Iraq. We have evry right to remove that threat before,not after,they carry out on them!
Wake up sasca!
Riffhard |
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| sasca |
Riffhard, I don't want this to be unpleasant. Though I may have disagreed with your posts, they have been intelligent and thoughtful, unlike those of some others. What worries people is that 9/11 has so spooked the US that it's answer is now too easily war. I know you don't agree. But since the people who are now telling us it is self-evident that we should go to war are those who felt it was self-evident before 9/11 that it was not neccessary (see Rice's comments about Saddam not being able to use nuclear weapons) it is fair to question how clearly they are seeing.
Perhaps I am a fool for not supporting war. But I am in some damn fine company. |
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| Sir Stonesalot |
It WAS evident say 3 years ago! But we were still trying the diplomatic approach 3 years ago. We were still giving Saddam the chance to disarm, and conform to the UN resolutions. How many years do you suggest we give the evil bastard to comply?
Saddam has used up his time. I'd say he has a matter of days left.
It's not like the US just up and decided that Saddam was bad. No no. We have given him 12 years sasca! 12 YEARS! I'd say that shows remarkable restraint on the part of the US. How much longer should we give him? Enough time to rebuild his inventory of SCUDs? Enough time to build some "dirty" bombs? Or even get his hands on some Nukes? Shall we give him THAT much time sascy? Shall we give him the time to help Al-Queda blow up some more skyscrapers, kill thousands?
sasca, and all the rest of you who want to avoid war...that is a very noble sentiment. I don't really think the US or her allies want war either. But Saddam does. Saddam has had 12 years to stop this war, and all he has done in that time is push the situation closer and closer to war. In fact, he has been trying to re-arm, re-equip, retrain and refill his Army's ranks.
War sucks. I wish Saddam thought so too.
Have you ever thought about the prospect that by acting now, we are actually SAVING lives in the long haul? Kill a few to save many. Horrible but necessary. |
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| sasca |
Yes, I have. Believe me, I worry about such things a great deal and there is much of me that agrees with you. I have in this thread been concerned with slowing down other's eagerness, that does not mean it is not in me, too.
It comes back to the question - how can I kill if I am not sure? And I'm not. And I can't.
[Edited by sasca] |
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| Pants Make the Man |
On a more positive note: Pakistani swine are leaving New York by the herd. They have taken objection to having to register (as Muslim's ie they pledge allegiance, starting in youth, to the total anhialation of Israel and, Allah willing, America and her interests) with certain government agencies. Don't let the door hit you in the ass, I say.
Let's take an abridged look at Pakistan's tally sheet. It reads like a sasca wet dream (no appeasement for sasca, that psycho, pseudo-intellectual cunt):
*The destruction of centuries old Hindu temples/shrines (in conjunction with the taliban).
*Multiple fire bombing of churches containing women and children
*Fire bombings of trains.
*Tried like hell to provide safe haven for Osama Jinn Laden...up until we vaporised his ass, that is.
*Sanwiched in between that, you have Danny Pearl getting his throat slit and then decapitated for no reason...on camera
Muslim swine. It's past time to get down to the brass tack's. Don't let me down, George. What's the holdup? |
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| jb |
Beautiful post "Pants". |
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| telecaster |
quote:
Pants Make the Man wrote:
*The destruction of centuries old Hindu temples/shrines (in conjunction with the taliban).
*Multiple fire bombing of churches containing women and children
*Fire bombings of trains.
*Tried like hell to provide safe haven for Osama Jinn Laden...up until we vaporised his ass, that is.
*Sanwiched in between that, you have Danny Pearl getting his throat slit and then decapitated for no reason...on camera
Muslim swine. It's past time to get down to the brass tack's. Don't let me down, George. What's the holdup?
Also add in the Muslims we saved with the Bosnia bombings
have since turned around and burnt 300 Christian churches. |
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| Sir Stonesalot |
Who the heck is asking you to kill anyone? As far as I know, you can simply stay at home and watch it on TV. You don't have to pull a trigger.
For that matter, neither does anyone from France or Germany. Or anywhere else that doesn't want to be involved. The US can do all the dirty work(Maxy, are you reading this?)if we have to.
I understand the point of the US jumping at the opportunity of war too quickly after 9/11. But this is not the case with Iraq. Saddam has had more than a decade to comply with UN resolutions...and he hasn't done it. To the contrary, he has actually intentionally broken those resolutions repeatedly. Saddam only signed those resolutions to buy time to prepare for round #2.
The US resolve in Iraq is also a clear message to the other "evil" gov'ts of the world. No country will be allowed to endanger the world's security and freedom.
I'm done with this thread. I've said what I wanted to say. All that is left to do now, is wait and see what happens. If it is military action, I hope it is quick, decisive, and with very few casualties. If it is peace, then halleluja! But either way, Saddam's regime must be removed from power.
Our world deserves to be free of tyrants. |
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| jb |
Sasca, you have now become universally despised on this board. I suggest, at a minimum, an apology to all of the Americans on this site. If you show true remorse, I will consider allowing you to continue to post. |
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| Pants Make the Man |
Why, thank you, JB. I wasn't sure on how to spell anhialation. I can use it in a sentence, though. |
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| sasca |
Of course, if I were not a pacifist, the first people I would kill would be bigots like jb and Pants as immediate obstacles to peace. Pants sees fit to comment on the situation in Pakistan when it is obvious he could scarcely find it on a map (remember our Indian expert's knowledge of Farsi?)
The relationship between Islam and Judaism has, over their history, been better than that between Christianity and Judaism. Jews held honoured positions in Islamic society while they were spat on by Christians.
I would like to point out that I am not much of a fan of any monotheistic religion - they tend too easily towards fanaticism - and am much more at home amongst the gods of Hinduism or Ancient Greece. |
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| sasca |
Because, SS, I do not believe in mewling bullshit about 'non-combatants'. If you support those who kill you are, morally, pretty much a killer. Hasn't this whole thread been about support?
[Edited by sasca] |
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| Pants Make the Man |
quote:
jb wrote:
Sasca, you have now become universally despised on this board. I suggest, at a minimum, an apology to all of the Americans on this site. If you show true remorse, I will consider allowing you to continue to post.
I second the motion. |
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| sasca |
Am I universally despised? No. Some have agreed with me. And I have said nothing insulting about the USA, unlike others about France and Germany. But I'm tired of this and all those who find pacifism more objectionable than genocide.
In WW2 you would, jb, have hated the Nips. You are no liberal. You are a bigot.
[Edited by sasca] |
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| LadyJane |
OMG, somebody forward me the airfare to South Africa and I'll kick Sasca's sorry ass!
Sasca--SHUT THE FUCK UP!! I'm a liberal Democrat from New York State who hated Ronald Reagan, admired Bill Clinton and thinks George W is an idiot.
However, it is crystal clear to me that Saddam MUST GO. I think Germany and France are a bunch of pussies. They'll gladly take our financial aid, but won't cover our backs!!
NO ONE LIKES WAR, BUT SOMETIMES IT'S THE ONLY MEANS TO AN END!!!
Now, go read some Farsi! And talk to me when you are about 20 years older. Well see if you still have the same idealistic outlook on life!!!
LadyJ.
PS. Re my comments about my political view, spare me the insults, I'm not in the mood to argue!! Only with Sasca. |
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| Maxlugar |
Man I hope you are good looking sasca.
Because there isn't much real thinking going on upstairs, ya know?
Anyway........
WHERE ARE THE BOMBS, W.????
WHY ARE WE NOT BOMBING????
WE GAVE IRAQ TOO MUCH INFO YESTERDAY!!!!
BOMB BOMB BOMB!!!!
Maxy, The War Monger. |
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| Pants Make the Man |
Whew, you do speak out of your faggot ass, sasca. They'd stone you to death in Pakistan, fairy.
Kashmir belongs to India.
HAHAHAHA!!!
Palestine belongs to the Jews. |
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| jb |
You are French!!!! |
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| Pants Make the Man |
quote:
telecaster wrote:
Also add in the Muslims we saved with the Bosnia bombings
have since turned around and burnt 300 Christian churches.
Typical Muslim swine.
C'mon, George W Bush! Let's get this party started! Yeah! Turn up the bass!
Peace out...
Burn in hell, sasca... |
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| icydanger |
you can add to france and germany russia and china
the towel head talking |
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| telecaster |
quote:
LadyJane wrote:
OMG, somebody forward me the airfare to South Africa and I'll kick Sasca's sorry ass!
Sasca--SHUT THE FUCK UP!! I'm a liberal Democrat from New York State who hated Ronald Reagan, admired Bill Clinton and thinks George W is an idiot.
However, it is crystal clear to me that Saddam MUST GO. I think Germany and France are a bunch of pussies. They'll gladly take our financial aid, but won't cover our backs!!
NO ONE LIKES WAR, BUT SOMETIMES IT'S THE ONLY MEANS TO AN END!!!
Now, go read some Farsi! And talk to me when you are about 20 years older. Well see if you still have the same idealistic outlook on life!!!
LadyJ.
PS. Re my comments about my political view, spare me the insults, I'm not in the mood to argue!! Only with Sasca.
LadyJ! Wow, sick em! |
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| Riffhard |
While I may question sasca's view of the world and the sanctomonious BS that goes with it. I certainly don't wish him any ill will. This thread has been a very good debate that I would hate to see desinigrate into a sasca bitch slapping session. Sasca,while I don't even come close to understanding your reasoning. You certainly have the right to your opinions. As fucked as they may be to some of us.
I think that the reason many Americans are so perplexed and irritated by the veiws of much of Europe,including the population of the UK,is that in our country's history we have always tried to stand up for what is right. We have liberated,not colonized,more countries than any other country on the face of the earth for the last several decades. We have ALWAYS been their for our friends. Our country took a massive hit a couple of years ago. At the time even France ran headlines that read "We Are All Americans!" Then in two short years all good will has been forgotten. Our president has been called an idiot,a cowboy,and a war monger. Those are the nice comments! Why? It's fairly simple. It's because he has the forsight to act against a tyrannt who has been thumping his nose at the UN for twelve long years now! The UN's rellevence is on the line and noone except the US and the UK and some other allies seem to care.
The fact that much of Europe and their populations seem to look down their collective noses at our country and our president is insulting to most Americans. The holy than thou bullshit would be merely laughable if it weren't so utterly meanspirited and seemingly ungrateful for the help that our country has given the continent of France and Germany!
If France and Germany,and the populations of most of Europe including England,seem to think that it's ok for Saddam to play them all has a bunch of saps thats fine. I for one am very proud of the fact that once again the USA is going to carry out the resolutions that the collective UN Security Counsel passed. The UN has no problem passing International law. They just don't have the balls to enforce them. So while many in Europe debate the evidence that was so clearly laid before them by Powell,and has been staring them in the face for TWELVE LONG YEARS now, the USA will once again "Strap It On",to borrow a line from Figi,and do the right thing!
France and Germany can bitch about it all they want. They will,as always,be thanking and dissmissing us later!
F'ing ingrates!
Riffhard
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